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U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

nytimes.com

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Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#131

Post by watwut »

rhelz wrote: post #29
pstuart wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I loathed the actions of DOGE but believe that "government efficiency" (yeah, lily oxymoronic) should be baked into everything the government does, most importantly, even the programs that one supports. That has been one of many failures of the Dems to both pursue and socialize.

The federal government is actually quite efficient in what it does. For example, the overhead for Social Security is between 0.5% and 1%. I.E, less than the mutual funds in my 401k charge per yeah for "administrative fees." When people talk about government waste, what they really are talking about is things the government does which they don't approve of. E.g. ICE--is that wasteful spending? Depends upon whether you…

DOGE achieved their goal - take the info and speed up destruction of the state, of public service.

Oh, and stop or limit research into anything not centered at white men.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#133

Post by abenga »

qzx_pierri wrote: post #32
rhelz wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The federal government is actually quite efficient in what it does. For example, the overhead for Social Security is between 0.5% and 1%. I.E, less than the mutual funds in my 401k charge per yeah for "administrative fees." When people talk about government waste, what they really are talking about is things the government does which they don't approve of. E.g. ICE--is that wasteful spending? Depends upon whether you…

[flagged]

A team of outsiders got carte blanche to find and kill waste in your government. How much did they find?

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#134

Post by croon »

lokar wrote: post #93

The media should report the number that actually matters: debt to GDP ratio. It’s quite high as well, but it’s the more meaningful number.

And yet more meaningful than that is what the debt increase is spent on. If it's infrastructure/education/etc, productivity/population welfare will rise over time. If it's debt through tax cuts, temporary productivity might be argued (some of the GDP here), but the nation will be in decline.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#135

Post by epolanski »

DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #130
epolanski wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference is that this administration is running at double the rate of the previous ones, and George Bush oversaw both two wars and the global financial crisis in 2007. Your argument "since you're already over the speed limit, 200 or 300 miles per hour don't matter". Sounds asinine. In any case I didn't say anything about democrats, but for sure, this administration with large tax cuts and increased spending is…

Well all the other administrations were driving 200 or 300 miles over, now we are driving 500 over. It doesn't matter really, if we hit anything (like Japan dumping US treasuries) we may be dead. The democrats thing was what I had originally replied to. My whole point is that it really doesn't matter who is in the White House really, both sides seem determined to rack up as much debt as possible and it'll probably sp…

This is true globally, not just in the US, and that's why global debt keeps spiralling.

But I still find the argument "it doesn't matter if you're going 200 or 300 or 500 mph" completely asinine. It does, and it makes an enormous difference when the debt is so big in absolute terms.

You keep forcing an equality that's not there.

At the end of the day it's one specific administration that brought the largest tax cuts in history since 1981's Reagan (another republican) ones while increasing spending.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#136

Post by rbanffy »

DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #125
donohoe wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They just told you what the difference is.

There is no practical difference. Both parties are glad to drive the car off a cliff

The big difference is that, at the current rate, economic collapse of the US will happen in my lifetime, and I’m almost 60. I wasn’t looking forward to that kind of planetary upheaval for my retirement.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#137

Post by rbanffy »

DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #130
epolanski wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference is that this administration is running at double the rate of the previous ones, and George Bush oversaw both two wars and the global financial crisis in 2007. Your argument "since you're already over the speed limit, 200 or 300 miles per hour don't matter". Sounds asinine. In any case I didn't say anything about democrats, but for sure, this administration with large tax cuts and increased spending is…

Well all the other administrations were driving 200 or 300 miles over, now we are driving 500 over. It doesn't matter really, if we hit anything (like Japan dumping US treasuries) we may be dead. The democrats thing was what I had originally replied to. My whole point is that it really doesn't matter who is in the White House really, both sides seem determined to rack up as much debt as possible and it'll probably sp…

> now we are driving 500 over

Keep in mind the car is not designed to generate lift at that speed.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#138

Post by rbanffy »

epolanski wrote: post #135
DoesntMatter22 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well all the other administrations were driving 200 or 300 miles over, now we are driving 500 over. It doesn't matter really, if we hit anything (like Japan dumping US treasuries) we may be dead. The democrats thing was what I had originally replied to. My whole point is that it really doesn't matter who is in the White House really, both sides seem determined to rack up as much debt as possible and it'll probably sp…

This is true globally, not just in the US, and that's why global debt keeps spiralling. But I still find the argument "it doesn't matter if you're going 200 or 300 or 500 mph" completely asinine. It does, and it makes an enormous difference when the debt is so big in absolute terms. You keep forcing an equality that's not there. At the end of the day it's one specific administration that brought the largest tax cuts…

> and that's why global debt keeps spiralling.

Yes, but if the dollar collapses and is replaced by a new reserve currency while other countries have debts in dollars, they win and the US loses. Only the US loses, keep in mind. It’ll be the first time the US experiences that side of the stick.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#139

Post by rbanffy »

fragmede wrote: post #60
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I mean, there's fiscally responsible but the welfare department is never gonna make money at the end of the day spending is a political football. Trump's ICE got $10 billion, because what? So now in addition to DEA we have ICE and the TSA, and well, we can't un spend that money and shut them down so, well, shit.

> the welfare department is never gonna make money

No, but taxes make money and if you just stop spending on things like ICE and their concentration camps or overpriced and ineffective military action and equipment, you’ll see there is a lot of money left for giving everyone healthcare and a college education.

As an engineer, things like the F-35 are beautiful, and I want them to be developed - but war is changing fast and what was effective a generation ago is now vulnerable to cheap drones.

Re: U.S. Debt Hits $40T as America's Borrowing Binge Continues

#140

Post by bamboozled »

solid_fuel wrote: post #74
bamboozled wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue was that Project 2025 seemed like something conspiracy theorists believed in, I didn't see Trump go on Rogan with a folder called Project 2025 and read through it with him and discuss the real plans outlined in the book. There was basically two competing agendas, one was kept more secretive because they knew it wasn't popular, and then there was the campaign promises, which IMO is what people believed in, a…

> The issue was that Project 2025 seemed like something conspiracy theorists believed in, I didn't see Trump go on Rogan with a folder called Project 2025 and read through it with him and discuss the real plans outlined in the book. And in 2016, I may have been sympathetic to this argument. By the time 2024 had rolled around, we had already endured the trainwreck of his first administration, his failures while handli…

Look, ultimately here is where I disagree: I am not willing to give any of his supporters the benefit of the doubt anymore.

I think more people chose not to vote because they didn't really like Biden (too old) and didn't really believe project 2025 was real, that was more what I meant with that comment.

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