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Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

ysph.yale.edu

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Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#941

Post by onraglanroad »

matteoraso wrote: post #828
onraglanroad wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> someone has to approve or deny healthcare. Every universal system does it too, but by government policy instead of corporate decision That's another lie you've been told and believed. With Universal Healthcare the government just provides the funding. Medical decisions are made by Doctors.

>With Universal Healthcare the government just provides the funding. And what makes you think that they fund everything? I support universal healthcare as well (I'm literally Canadian), but I can accept that there are tradeoffs associated with it.

They don't fund everything. They don't fund anything in particular.

They provide the funding and the medical professionals decide how best to allocate that funding for the best results.

It's a bit different in Canada to my situation in Scotland since there is also the choice of private healthcare here if you want to pay more to skip queues etc.

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#942

Post by onraglanroad »

consensus1 wrote: post #506
onraglanroad wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> someone has to approve or deny healthcare. Every universal system does it too, but by government policy instead of corporate decision That's another lie you've been told and believed. With Universal Healthcare the government just provides the funding. Medical decisions are made by Doctors.

I would love to know how universal healthcare works in your head

It's not how it works in my head: it's the reality of how it works here.

To quote from my other reply:

They don't fund everything. They don't fund anything in particular.

They provide the funding and the medical professionals decide how best to allocate that funding for the best results.

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#943

Post by onraglanroad »

nradov wrote: post #494
onraglanroad wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> someone has to approve or deny healthcare. Every universal system does it too, but by government policy instead of corporate decision That's another lie you've been told and believed. With Universal Healthcare the government just provides the funding. Medical decisions are made by Doctors.

Nonsense. In every nationalized healthcare system there is care rationing performed by government bureaucrats. Regardless of a doctor's opinion on medical necessity, some treatments involve long waiting lists or third-party reviews or are simply unavailable. That might be preferable to our current system in certain ways but let's not pretend that there are no trade-offs. For example, let's say you're in England and y…

The lie you're believing is that the decision is made by government bureaucrats.

See my other reply in this thread.

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#944

Post by onraglanroad »

nradov wrote: post #490
onraglanroad wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you just make it compulsory to accept Medicare. Actually I thought that was already the case.

The "just" is doing some heavy lifting there. Clinicians aren't required to participate in Medicare; in fact they have to go through a complex process in order to join. And there's no way that such a mandate could ever pass Congress, or be effectively enforced. Let's focus on reforms that are actually achievable in the real world. https://www.cms.gov/medicare/enrollment-renewal/providers-su...

Seems to me you're more interested in finding problems than solutions.

Every other developed country has managed it so why don't you look to see how they achieved it?

Wouldn't you like to never worry about healthcare costs again?

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#945

Post by pyronik19 »

nradov wrote: post #700
pyronik19 wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ACA is horrible for the middle class. The only reason it retains any type of popularity is because the media refuses to associated ballooning cost to cost redistribution that it enables. Preexisting conditions? Middle class family picking that up. Subsidy? Middle class family picking that up.

In a wealthy and civilized society we have a moral obligation to care for all of our citizens. Some of them have pre-existing conditions and can't afford to pay market rates, so the middle class is going to have to subsidize them one way or another. Whether that subsidy comes in the form of higher insurance premiums or higher taxes hardly matters.

[dead]

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#946

Post by testing22321 »

limagnolia wrote: post #893
testing22321 wrote: post #756

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are 27 million Americans without healthcare, are why is medical bankruptcy so common? A massive percentage of the population don’t have and/or can’t afford healthcare. By definition, that is not a good system.

1)People who choose not to buy insurance because we don't force them to. 2) Adults in the remaining states that chose not to extend medicare who don't earn enough to qualify for ACA subsidies. 3) Adults who qualify for subsidies but still can't afford relativly expensive ACA plans. 4) Others? Not sure if that number includes noncitizens who don't qualify for assistance?

That sounds extremely complicated and confusing to navigate.

We’re checking out of hospital right now after an overnight stay for my 2 year olds surgery.

Never a single piece of paper, and of course no bill. They’re sending us home with the pain meds we need for the next week, plus a stack of yogurt and jello for the little one.

Life is pretty simple when you want it to be.

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#947

Post by breakyerself »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #916
arh5451 wrote: post #908

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UK has a "universal system" as does Germany and the inevitable reality is that if administration does not limit/deny overuse of the system then it requires setting prices artifically low to limit costs. --> Causes Doctors to earn less wages and be overworked (many med cases). Ultimately, less doctors. =(

Alternatively, the government starts relaxing legal requirements on medical schools with the intent to flood the market with doctors. This not only severely depresses their wages, it leads to unemployment and indirectly to charlatanism and quackery as people try to make ends meet. Better hope the future AI doctors are good.

Alternatively alternatively the government could subsidize medical school for doctors and nurses reducing financial barriers and allowing more medical professionals without lowering standards.

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#948

Post by breakyerself »

timr wrote: post #890
beloch wrote: post #839

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Healthcare costs have been rising faster than inflation, and a staggering share of that spending is consumed by administrative middlemen, soaring drug prices, and emergency care for conditions that should have been treated earlier and for less" ----- It's a n-tuple-whammy. Co-pays and deductibles discourage early diagnoses by preventing most people from visiting doctors for issues that aren't serious. The painful pr…

You’re blaming it on lack preventative care, but the truth is that there is very little preventative care that is shown to be effective at anything more than burning money. The few things that are effective (e.g. vaccines) are largely inexpensive, and don’t require “insurance” as we know it. Most of the things that are predictable and lead to long-term bad outcomes are behavioral (i.e. diet and exercise; smoking cess…

No ability to prevent cancer? Ever heard of the HPV vaccine? I had polyps removed from my colon 10 years ago. There's a decent chance those would have developed into colon cancer by now. Prevention is a major part of reducing deaths from cancer. See also the effects of increasing taxes on tobacco products or restrictions on the use of asbestos.

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#949

Post by cindyllm »

testing22321 wrote: post #946
limagnolia wrote: post #893

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1)People who choose not to buy insurance because we don't force them to. 2) Adults in the remaining states that chose not to extend medicare who don't earn enough to qualify for ACA subsidies. 3) Adults who qualify for subsidies but still can't afford relativly expensive ACA plans. 4) Others? Not sure if that number includes noncitizens who don't qualify for assistance?

That sounds extremely complicated and confusing to navigate. We’re checking out of hospital right now after an overnight stay for my 2 year olds surgery. Never a single piece of paper, and of course no bill. They’re sending us home with the pain meds we need for the next week, plus a stack of yogurt and jello for the little one. Life is pretty simple when you want it to be.

[dead]

Re: Universal health coverage could save $1T and 114k lives a year: study

#950

Post by tmp10423288442 »

limagnolia wrote: post #872
Jimega36 wrote: post #854

Switzerland has the system closest to the US in my experience, but with universal coverage. As individual, you buy basic insurance costing roughly $500/month with a $2500 yearly deductible (LAMal/KVG). Applicants must be accepted even with pre-existing conditions. Post-deductible, you pay 10% co-insurance capped at roughly $800/year (no medical bankruptcy). Insurers operate basic plans as non-profit. They make their…

Where are you getting the 150 to visit a Dr. in the US? The copay is usually much, much lower than that.

Really depends on your insurance, and whether you're visiting for a yearly physical or for an actual concern.
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