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Being ambitious and being a dad

nicholascharriere.com

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Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#421

Post by amouat »

spicyusername wrote: post #398

The older I get the more I realize ambition and "being ambitious" is a completely misplaced way to orient your life. The chance of validation from others is not a good reason for making one choice or another and a life made of choices of that kind will eventually leave you spiritually bankrupt. Make decisions based on what you're passionate about, based on what will bring and keep meaningful relationships into your l…

I don't disagree, except that you've taken ambitious to mean climbing the corporate ladder, which is a relatively narrow reading.

It can also mean wanting a achieve a large dream or goal e.g. writing a book.

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#422

Post by [deleted] »

kakacik wrote: post #301
afc wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting perspective. Your first paragraph also describes my experience, perfectly. However, even though I also think nothing comes even close to parenthood for me, my perspective is that society strongly encourages —I'd even say strongly pressures— people to have kids, to feel that if you don't, it's almost like something is wrong with you. Maybe we're just different generations? :-)

No modern western society does that, for quite some time. Maybe specific people around you behave so, but society as a whole? Nah

[deleted]

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#423

Post by Upvoter33 »

astura wrote: post #334
enjrolas wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a parent, I get to give you The Most Infuriating Answer: once you have kids, you'll understand.

I mean, ok, they might just understand or they might hate their children with a fiery passion and never miss and opportunity to vocalize it and ruin innocent lives like my parents did? One of the two I guess.

I’m sorry to hear that about your parents.

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#424

Post by nonethewiser »

alphabeta3r56 wrote: post #270
Derbasti wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The passionate hunger to do something significant and meaningful with my life was a major reason I took care never to have any children. Raising kids is probably the most meaningful and significant thing I have done with my life.

Why? Noy disputing you but I am childless yet primarily I cannot think why bringing up a kid would be significant or meaningful. Like once I have a kid, then that kid has to be the most significant part of my life. But before that, why?

>Why? Noy disputing you but I am childless yet primarily I cannot think why bringing up a kid would be significant or meaningful.

Its because they are more important than anything else to a parent. You are invested in their outcome more than anything else. I don’t see how this isn’t obvious.

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#425

Post by paweladamczuk »

citizenkeen wrote: post #392
katzgrau wrote: post #59

YC reject so I bootstrapped and was thankfully able to hit profitability before my first kid showed up. I’ve now got two. I also have dreams bigger than ever. In fact, writing this while sitting on the couch with the kids watching Muppet Treasure Island while my kids are wearing pirate hats and waving foam swords. I’m still extremely productive and prolific. Probably less compared with before. But before, I had frien…

I noticed housework wasn’t mentioned in this idealized schedule.

I noticed the same. Housework consumes a LOT of my time. But maybe that's just because of income level and failure to delegate?

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#426

Post by xyzelement »

I was thinking lately how lucky I am to have gotten good guidance from my parents and grandparents that oriented me well to life and work. I think this is / used to be more commonly understood or maybe just seems that way.

Ambition and drive are important but there's an important "so what" there as well. Am I aimlessly ambitious or am I ambitious for the sake of being able to support my family and make a significant impact on the world? If you are lucky enough to have the second orientation then I think there's less conflict between these things.

I have plenty to tech and finance friends who are successful and in our mid 40s, and unfortunately for those who neglected to have the family side of the equation, the shine is wearing off. What's the point of making the next level promotion and making the next 200k pay bump when what you do with it is come back to your apartment by yourself? Sure it's more comfortable and could still be fun to be ambitious and successful but it's lacking the goal piece.

The other half of my friends have family and then the financial etc success feeds directly into it. Can you give your family a good home, a good education, good experiences? It's easier for me to call a "success" a friend with a 4 bedroom house with 3 kids on it, than one with a Manhattan penthouse with no kids in it, even if the homes cost the same. It's just a different dimension.

The other thing is - making the world a better place for the future. The kids you raise and the work you achieve both feed into that. And also the future you are building is something that will benefit your kids - so all the things are aligned.

Then it becomes a "simple" balance - what's the thing that maximizes what I actually want to achieve. I want to be a good father and that takes both being with the kids, and working to make money - and also to set a good example for them of what work looks like. So yes in a simple sense you become less productive because you are going to work fewer hours, but I don't feel less productive in the grand total of life because all the things I am doing across work and family add up to what I want to accomplish.

I am curiosit - I bet many people will read this and think "of course, I feel the same way and what other way to feel is there" and others will say "I disagree at the root" which goes back to this being something with how your family raised you and the perspective you have from it.

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#427

Post by xienze »

ColdStream wrote: post #168
xp84 wrote: post #87

I have a good friend who has a special needs kid and we've discussed his struggles at length - suffice it to say that it takes an order of magnitude more time and attention than what's described here. The thing is, you of course don't get tipped off that you've been selected for that particular curse (and yes, I'd say it's a curse. It's not some inspiring after-school special thing, it's unfair as f*k to all involved…

> And I say this as someone who is very in favor of having kids and who worries about the looming population collapse in all developed countries. Complete aside, I hope that this happens via the demographic collapse and not due to resource/environmental blow back. It would be the smoothest path down. In the same way that inflation is a smoother way to grow a pool of poverty.

> Complete aside, I hope that this happens via the demographic collapse

The problem is, there isn't _going_ to be a population collapse in developed countries. The path these governments have chosen is to import anyone and everyone in order to keep the numbers growing. Why? Because all those wonderful social programs collapse without people at the bottom of the pyramid to keep things going. The main problem is there's only so many net contributors that can be imported, so we're really scraping the bottom of the barrel for people to bring in and oh yeah, they're eligible for social programs from day one. It's going to be a disaster long term, but it's the future we chose -- "I don't want kids, but I don't want the systems that are in place to collapse either, so sure, bring in the entire world, I'm sure we'll be fine."

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#428

Post by rTX5CMRXIfFG »

alphabeta3r56 wrote: post #270
Derbasti wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The passionate hunger to do something significant and meaningful with my life was a major reason I took care never to have any children. Raising kids is probably the most meaningful and significant thing I have done with my life.

Why? Noy disputing you but I am childless yet primarily I cannot think why bringing up a kid would be significant or meaningful. Like once I have a kid, then that kid has to be the most significant part of my life. But before that, why?

I’m surprised this hasn’t come up yet: Because by being a parent, you become responsible for someone else’s life besides your own, permanently and beyond the transactional or contractual sense of a job or a passion project. It is a life experience unmatched by anything else (though I think that being a teacher or the caretaker of children in an orphanage come close). You get free reign over the shaping of a person who will touch the lives of others, and the good or the bad that becomes of it is the consequence of your own values and way of existence.

Not disputing you either—I once said I will never have children, too—but indeed and as with other life decisions, you should stay childless while you find the meaning of it incomprehensible. It’s not for people who are not ready to stop thinking about themselves.

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#429

Post by criddell »

alphabeta3r56 wrote: post #337
russelldjimmy wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree with the sibling comment. As a new father, nothing - and I mean absolutely nothing - can describe the love, adoration and reverence that parents feel for their children. To be understood, it must be experienced. There is simply no other way.

Thanks for the answer. And I understand that. But for me, that answer is potentially a very biased answer. Is it a feeling that comes naturally or is it forced in the sense that you realise you are everything for the kid and the kid is everything for you and both you the kid have no other choice. Talking to a lot of people (bit you) i felt it was more the latter.

It didn't come naturally for me. Babies aren't much fun. There were plenty of times I wondered why everybody else finds being a parent fulfilling and here I am trying not to swear at a crying six month old at 1 am.

Toddlers though... toddlers are fun. Not always, but a lot of the time. Once both of my kids cleared the baby stage I finally would describe myself as a proud parent, mostly happy.

Now we are empty nesters and both of my kids live far away and are doing great. With the space that leaves I've spent some time thinking about myself as a dad and boy do I have a lot of regrets. I don't think I was very good at it.

I understand now why so many people who weren't the greatest parents get very excited about grandchildren. I know if that happens for me, I'm going to be a much better grandparent than I ever was parent.

Re: Being ambitious and being a dad

#430

Post by jraby3 »

Gareth321 wrote: post #266
Derbasti wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The passionate hunger to do something significant and meaningful with my life was a major reason I took care never to have any children. Raising kids is probably the most meaningful and significant thing I have done with my life.

Agreed. I'm well travelled. Have had a very fun and satisfying dating life. A great career. Accomplished many life goals. Nothing comes close to fatherhood. Which frustrates me immensely, because I feel that society at large did everything it could to convince me that parenthood is terrible. Movies and TV shows portrayed only the bad. Teachers told me that becoming a parent was the worst thing in the whole world. A w…

I've thought about this and while I agree with you completely, I think the reason why is not just society at large. Externally what most people see is the time suck, money suck, and frustration with teaching behavior, fixing bad behavior etc.

What's so easy to miss is the immense feeling of love, of being needed, of being loved, that words can't describe. I frequently tell people I feel like the grinch after he discovers Xmas - my heart is three times bigger. But you can't really see that it's just a feeling I carry with me.

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