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California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

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Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that could not also be a citable offense?

We could also make cooking up hair brained schemes to regulate minutia a citable offense.

I would argue that someone driving around with 60 psi in tires that are supposed to be 33 is a smidgeon more than minutiae, since there is a real risk.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right after we have a social stigma for people that keep voting to have the government involved in every bit of their lives.

How about when the market fails customers, still no government involvement? Food and drugs regulation, environment stuff (you are here) and so on?

The US military-industrial complex is the single largest institutional hydrocarbon consumer and greenhouse gas emitter on the planet. It would be pretty stupid for me to listen to the government's advice about how best we should preserve the environment.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#223
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The road scales are easily gamed, or just avoided. Yes, they stated that in the second half, and I addressed it. What's the first half?

Most scales don't even log/alert/flag weights below the maximum legal axle weight or axle group weight. So a 2-axle truck can weigh 40k and nobody will hear about it. In the event that they're fancy and integrated with an ALPR (assuming your plate is readable, lots of ways to game that on a box truck) the scales don't typically extend onto the paved shoulder. Even if they do you slow down and drop a tire off the pave…

Ah thanks! So a design/operation flaw of the scales! I didn't realize they were run/monitored so incompetently, where concepts like "make sure the truck is actually on the scale" were ignored. But, I'm in no way surprised! That's governing bodies for ya!

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, I have these tires on my Model 3: https://www.contimediacenter.com/eulabel/en/03143300000/ After 15,000 km, they haven't worn down by 2 mm. And that's despite being an EV. I think it really depends on how you drive.

Well, how do you drive? And in what climate?

I live in Northern Germany so a temperate climate all in all, although nowadays it gets really hot during the summer.

Well everyone says they are a good driver, and probably they are not. But I like to drive in a way that I rarely if ever have to engage the breaks. I also try to spread the regen distance if that makes sense, so it doesn't do a hard stop but slows down... gently over a longer distance. And when it comes to curves I try to follow the late apex line approach.

I was also lucky with my car though, it came with an excellent wheel alignment which isn't always the case.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Michelin CrossClimate2 tires are arguably the best traction tires, In their class, but not in general. They are all-season tires. They don't perform as well as winter tires in the winter, and they don't perform as well as summer tires in the summer. They're also a terribly mushy tire. They feel like you're floating around on the road and wallowing through the turns. This doesn't matter in the slightest to someo…

I’ve not noticed a mushy feeling on my wife’s Mazda CX-9 with CC2s, but tbf it’s an SUV. One of the sportier SUVs around, but still. For reference, I used to daily a Honda S2000 (not with CC2s, obviously).

> I’ve not noticed a mushy feeling on my wife’s Mazda CX-9 with CC2s, but tbf it’s an SUV. One of the sportier SUVs around, but still.

They are not great in that regard. Casual drivers won't usually care, but anyone who pays attention to handling usually hates them.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, how do you drive? And in what climate?

I live in Northern Germany so a temperate climate all in all, although nowadays it gets really hot during the summer. Well everyone says they are a good driver, and probably they are not. But I like to drive in a way that I rarely if ever have to engage the breaks. I also try to spread the regen distance if that makes sense, so it doesn't do a hard stop but slows down... gently over a longer distance. And when it com…

Regen braking is pretty amazing, I love it. I wish it was more configurable, though.

I test drove the weird Mazda MX-30 and while it was too gutless and low-range to buy, one thing that impressed the hell out of me was the use of flappy-paddles behind the steering wheel to control regen strength. Felt like downshifting an automatic; you could set it to give you max regen without engaging the mechanical brakes, or total freewheeling. Made for some interesting hypermiling potential. Hopefully they ship a more complete EV one day!

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>They don't perform as well as winter tires in the winter, and A lot of people don't live in climates where winter tires are even sold; particularly California, Texas, Florida, three of the most populous states. Many people in those states aren't even aware "winter tires" are even a product category. That's like complaining the Walmart in Anchorage, Alaska doesn't carry SPF 50 sunscreen.

You're gonna want SPF 50 in Alaska too.

And Walmart has it in stock in Anchorage. So a moot point.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, how do you drive? And in what climate?

I live in Northern Germany so a temperate climate all in all, although nowadays it gets really hot during the summer. Well everyone says they are a good driver, and probably they are not. But I like to drive in a way that I rarely if ever have to engage the breaks. I also try to spread the regen distance if that makes sense, so it doesn't do a hard stop but slows down... gently over a longer distance. And when it com…

Every time you enter regen, you're engaging the brakes as far as the tires are concerned.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#229
post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's even worse than that. Rain performance and rolling resistance are conflicting goals. A good rain tire will need more voids to channel the water, but adding a lot of voids increases rolling resistance. California is a large market. Tire manufacturers probably won't make many California-specific tires. They're going to try to adjust their tires to meet the California guidelines. The most populous areas of Californ…

Tire manufacturers tend to have different compounds for Europe (focused on lower rolling resistance) and North America (focused on traction and a wider range of working temperatures). I'd guess that California will now simply get the EU variants instead of the NA variants.

From what I remember European tired were often outperforming American tires in stopping performance and other metrics. So not sure that's true.

Re: California's new tire efficiency rules could save drivers $1B a year

#230
post #36

Probably the weirdest thing about this is the state doing something that results in it getting less tax money. This was lobbied for by the Natural Resources Defense Council and the Union of Concerned Scientists.

I assume you mean about buying less (taxed) gas. Never fear, California is also talking about shifting to a mileage baded road tax because EVs (which they heavily incentivized) saving money on gas can't go untaxed.

> California is also talking about shifting to a mileage baded road tax because EVs (which they heavily incentivized) saving money on gas can't go untaxed.

EVs in CA have a special $121 tax to make up for "don't pay gas tax."

The mileage-based road tax is for other reasons.

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