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Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

quantum5.ca

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Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#211

Post by KolmogorovComp »

bsimpson wrote: post #175
gonzalohm wrote: post #2

A bit off-topic, but kind of relevant. I firmly believe that if installing custom firmware voids the warranty of a device, installing official updates should extend the warranty. I'm tired of sloppy updates or change of behavior that mess with how I use MY device. At this point, I'm convinced Google is doing this on purpose. My Google TV has become slow since the Gemini update, which I wasn't asked if I wanted it. My…

> installing official updates should extend the warranty. That sounds like a big incentive to never ship updates.

Just also make compagnies liable about any unpatched security issues for hardware newer than X years.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#213

Post by shibapuppie »

anamexis wrote: post #210
shibapuppie wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"talk with an LLM to follow the correct steps" Or, if you need legal advice, go to a lawyer, not an LLM.

Consulting a lawyer would most likely be more expensive than whatever small claims compensation one would potentially be entitled to.

So you don't get your money back then. Using a hallucinating robot to guide you legally is a great way to be caught with your pants down.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#214

Post by quantum5 »

margalabargala wrote: post #198
quantum5 wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Original author here: Thanks for linking the documentation! To be clear, when I wrote "header", I meant something with a connector that can be easily used for this purpose. Soldering on the connector is probably more difficult than the pogo pins that I used. I also can't help but notice the linked connector is less than $1 in bulk on DigiKey and probably cheaper if ordered at Framework's scale.

Sure, but this is just one issue. How many potential $0.78 connectors exist? If one in 1000 customers has a need for a connector, and there are 40 different potential failure modes where a $0.78 connector would make recovery easier, is that worth the extra $30 per laptop?

I checked the pictures of my board, and there are 3 unpopulated headers that I can see. There's also the unpopulated BIOS chip socket, which is similarly cheap. I think I would pay the extra $3 per laptop for better repairability, which is Framework's entire sales pitch anyway.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#215

Post by throwaway2037 »

anamexis wrote: post #210
shibapuppie wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"talk with an LLM to follow the correct steps" Or, if you need legal advice, go to a lawyer, not an LLM.

Consulting a lawyer would most likely be more expensive than whatever small claims compensation one would potentially be entitled to.

You beat me to it! That is exactly my point: An LLM can guide you to find the forms, fill them, and gather your evidence. Even the cheapest lawyer will far exceed the 500 USD repair fee that is the basis of your small claims lawsuit!

Another thing (this is me guessing here): The standard for evidence and "legal excellence" must be far lower for small claims court, compared to regular district court. The whole point is to provide a very low cost way for average citizens to sue other citizens or companies for recourse. As I understand, most small claims courts don't need or require a lawyer.

Related anecdote: This year, there was a story of a single Japanese mother using an LLM to file a lawsuit against the father to establish paternity[1]. (Note: This was family court, which, again, will have many people attending that cannot afford a lawyer, but the judge will show care that they receive fairness, given their limited knowledge of the law.)

[1] https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20260325/p2a/00m/0na/02...

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#216

Post by quantum5 »

LeBit wrote: post #209
shibapuppie wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"talk with an LLM to follow the correct steps" Or, if you need legal advice, go to a lawyer, not an LLM.

In Canada , there are cases where people self represent in court because they think a LLM replaces an expensive lawyer. The last one that tried that was fined 5,000$ for wasting the court’s time.

Author here. I am not even sure how much damage I can actually claim given that I spent $20 on tools to fix the laptop. If I bought a new board, I might be able to claim that, but filing small claims over $20 is likely not worth anyone's time.

The important thing here is awareness and helping anyone affected, not trying to get Framework fined for a tiny sum.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#217

Post by anamexis »

shibapuppie wrote: post #213
anamexis wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consulting a lawyer would most likely be more expensive than whatever small claims compensation one would potentially be entitled to.

So you don't get your money back then. Using a hallucinating robot to guide you legally is a great way to be caught with your pants down.

Small claims court is specifically oriented towards self-representation and not requiring hiring an attorney.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#218

Post by aaronmdjones »

anamexis wrote: post #217
shibapuppie wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you don't get your money back then. Using a hallucinating robot to guide you legally is a great way to be caught with your pants down.

Small claims court is specifically oriented towards self-representation and not requiring hiring an attorney.

Yes, but there are free resources available that guide you on how to go through the process without consulting a hallucination machine.

Judges don't like their time being wasted, and they doubly don't like plaintiffs and defendants who don't even go to the effort of trying to follow decorum.

And, I'm just throwing this one out here; contempt of court is one of the vanishingly few civil offenses you can be held in custody for.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#219

Post by brewtide »

bsimpson wrote: post #175
gonzalohm wrote: post #2

A bit off-topic, but kind of relevant. I firmly believe that if installing custom firmware voids the warranty of a device, installing official updates should extend the warranty. I'm tired of sloppy updates or change of behavior that mess with how I use MY device. At this point, I'm convinced Google is doing this on purpose. My Google TV has become slow since the Gemini update, which I wasn't asked if I wanted it. My…

> installing official updates should extend the warranty. That sounds like a big incentive to never ship updates.

I don't know. I'm sitting here with a framework laptop consciously NOT updating it because I'm in no mood to have my computer SOL because a company can't seem to get their shit together?

Of note, I really like my framework, and I have installed BIOS updates on the past without issue. However, there have been a lot of firmware problems and fixes that are not fixes (battery related) and then bios updates that apparently cut the sound volume down to far lower levels than before the update, etc.

A user shouldn't have to worry about installing a BIOS update from the manufacturer causing the machine to die without circumstances like power loss, etc.

I feel personally that if such a BIOS update bricks someone's device, it should unquestionably be "we are sorry, let us send you out a new board asap". They can then reflash using pogo pins and send them out to other customers.

Accountability these days doesn't exist anywhere. It's making the world shit.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#220

Post by anamexis »

aaronmdjones wrote: post #218
anamexis wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small claims court is specifically oriented towards self-representation and not requiring hiring an attorney.

Yes, but there are free resources available that guide you on how to go through the process without consulting a hallucination machine. Judges don't like their time being wasted, and they doubly don't like plaintiffs and defendants who don't even go to the effort of trying to follow decorum. And, I'm just throwing this one out here; contempt of court is one of the vanishingly few civil offenses you can be held in cus…

And consulting an LLM is a great way to find guides and get basic information on feasibility and effort of bringing a claim. LLMs are not a replacement for critical thinking, and they never have been.
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