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Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

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Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#351

Post by kennywinker »

fourseventy wrote: post #248
kennywinker wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eating meat fills my belly. Setting my AC to 68 keeps me cool. A data center costs my community money, damages the environment directly and indirectly, and further enriches a few already rich people. Can you spot the difference?

You are posting on a website that is hosted in a data center right now. You use data centers at your job to send email, share documents, run software. When you go home and watch netflix, that video is streamed to you from a data center. All of the internet, your phone, and modern digital entertainment and life is run through data centers. My guess is that you don't seriously want to turn all of that off because 'reas…

We had all of that before the current wave of hyperscale data center buildout. So what NEW benefit do i get from all this?

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#352

Post by zzgo »

thegrim33 wrote: post #212

If even on Hacker News a topic like this can't be objectively discussed, what hope do we really have? What is the solution? Even in a place like this, the comments are full of extremist ideology, bickering, people arguing from feelings, people just repeating echo chambers mantras, and a significant portion of the comments are probably from inauthentic/propaganda accounts. We're incapable of just using a place like th…

> even on Hacker News a topic like this can't be objectively discussed

This site has as much of an ideological slant as any other site, this isn't a unique oasis in a sea of partisan echo chambers.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#353

Post by Groxx »

duplessitous wrote: post #336
Groxx wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, anything that gets people paying attention to stuff that has been building for decades is good in my book. I agree that'll be a much better end-state to be in, but is it the best right now ? ... idk. We're in an increasingly blatant "smash and grab" phase for major corporations right now, and they need to be stopped quickly .

Sure, but what is this comment if not a plea for someone else to do something? No one can live your ideals for you, if you think something should be done, you should do it, and quickly at that. If it is that urgent, why are you not doing anything?

You've been complaining that people blocking datacenters (which is partly succeeding) is worse than fixing the EPA.

Something is being done, urgently (vastly faster than the larger legal system), and public outrage is loud and annoying and widely visible, which is indeed what I want. Beyond that it isn't especially fair to say "if you like to eat, why haven't you solved world hunger", particularly when those EPA/zoning laws aren't in place yet, so I'll just ignore that part.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#354

Post by kennywinker »

somehnguy wrote: post #274
Symbiote wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of those are the old, smaller scale.

Can you elaborate on the scale difference?

I have a small home server setup. It’s stores all my data, and i can transcode video and stuff on it no problem.

I put in a GPU to run some local LLM stuff. Now the whole thing generates enough heat and noise that I notice it if i sit near the cabinet it’s in.

Scale matters.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#355

Post by dylan604 »

freeone3000 wrote: post #349
dylan604 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why should an individual accept any sacrifice whatsoever if all of the profit is going to go to the billionaires who own it? At some point, their 401Ks are going to depend on it.

45.7% of Americans don’t have a 401k. That’s not a convincing argument.

That's more people than elected the sitting president. Numbers don't really mean what you're trying to imply. Going the other way, 1% of the population hold the vast majority of the wealth while yielding all of the power.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#356

Post by sophacles »

whimsicalism wrote: post #281
sophacles wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's incredibly disingenuous to wonder why people would be concerned about projects that: * Take a bunch of their tax money with no benefit to them * lower their property value * Make electricity and water more expensive (both of which make other things they use more expensive also) * can cause other environmental impacts that raise inconvenience and expenses both directly and indirectly so some AI douchebags can hav…

i don't think either of the first two things are generally true (usually tax positive, new usecases generally raise property value). it sounds like you just want to ban American industry altogether, we've quietly let extreme conservatism sneak up on us in the US it seems.

WTF are you on about?

They aren't tax positive. The deal might "theoretically" be tax positive in 30 years if things go exactly according to some plan. In the short term they are usually associated with large tax breaks for some number of years, accompanied a guarantee to occupy the data-center for less than the payback period (so the tax breaks can be extended later with threats to move on so those tax paybacks never happen). They also come with the locality footing the bill for a lot of infrastructure build-out.

That's just a bad use of my tax dollars. Let the datacenter people pay for themselves at the very least - my taxes don't need to go subsidize some pile of shit AI fanatic. If you like AI, pay for your AI, don't take it from me. It has nothing to do with me being pro- or anti-industry, however if an already profitable industry can't exist without my tax subsidizing it just so some rich guy can be a little bit richer... well maybe it doesn't need to exist.

I have no idea how any of this is conservatism... I'm opposed to a specific set of changes, not all changes. Perhaps you are just trying to throw shade because I think you should pay for your own toys?

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#357

Post by kennywinker »

whimsicalism wrote: post #275
kennywinker wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eating meat fills my belly. Setting my AC to 68 keeps me cool. A data center costs my community money, damages the environment directly and indirectly, and further enriches a few already rich people. Can you spot the difference?

"i can't eat a cargo container so it's useless" -guy who can only see one level up the chain of abstractions that allow him to fill his belly.

Please, elaborate on how hyperscale ai datacenters are going to help fill my belly.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#358

Post by kennywinker »

himata4113 wrote: post #166
kennywinker wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eating meat fills my belly. Setting my AC to 68 keeps me cool. A data center costs my community money, damages the environment directly and indirectly, and further enriches a few already rich people. Can you spot the difference?

It directly and indirectly increases your quality of life and it is something you use every single day.

What is? The opposition is to datacenters being built to meet imagined future demand for LLMs. Are LLMs directly and indirectly increasing my quality of life? Please explain how, because so far it seems to me like they’re decreasing my quality of life.

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#359

Post by kennywinker »

ares623 wrote: post #307
kennywinker wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eating meat fills my belly. Setting my AC to 68 keeps me cool. A data center costs my community money, damages the environment directly and indirectly, and further enriches a few already rich people. Can you spot the difference?

The datacenter means I don't have read/write YAML anymore. Checkmate. I would burn the world than ever deal with YAML again.

This is the only response disagreeing with me that i consider valid. The man hates YAML. Hopefully you’re ok with Markdown…

Re: Field measurements of neighborhood-scale air temperature impacts of data centers

#360

Post by pibaker »

fourseventy wrote: post #248
kennywinker wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eating meat fills my belly. Setting my AC to 68 keeps me cool. A data center costs my community money, damages the environment directly and indirectly, and further enriches a few already rich people. Can you spot the difference?

You are posting on a website that is hosted in a data center right now. You use data centers at your job to send email, share documents, run software. When you go home and watch netflix, that video is streamed to you from a data center. All of the internet, your phone, and modern digital entertainment and life is run through data centers. My guess is that you don't seriously want to turn all of that off because 'reas…

How many racks do you think a niche, text only forum is going to take up?
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