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Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

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Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#181

Post by jakzurr »

sounds wrote: post #64
fwipsy wrote: post #33

Framework seems pretty popular here in general, but nobody really seems to talk about how repairable enterprise laptops are. Some laptops have clips around the edge of the bottom panel to hold it in place, which frequently break. On my brother's T480s, those clips were made out of metal and held in with screws, meaning they were themselves replaceable. More recently I worked on a Dell Precision 7550 laptop, and if yo…

In today's blog post, we are all studying the enshittification of the BIOS. In general, I agree with you that the bigger laptop makers can repair laptops and do an amazing job. What we're all here for though is 2026. No big company is coming to fix your machines, even big companies are waiting 30+ days for parts availability from the big company bros they bought from. If you're a consumer, forget about it. "Many of t…

omg, thanks so much!

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#182

Post by craftkiller »

mananaysiempre wrote: post #30
Gormo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's always been the case. Phoenix and AMI have been the dominant BIOS providers for over 30 years. Both have always provided modular tookits for OEMs to customize their own ROM images, write their own ACPI tables, etc. UEFI gives even more control to the OEMs. If Framework isn't doing that properly, that's on them.

It appears that Framework contracted out the development of their (Insyde-based) firmware to somebody who, to put it mildly, does not treat them as a priority. Either way, Framework’s firmware is really bad, and that’s entirely on Framework; you can look around on the forums for the horror stories in the (open) EC code around power delivery for instance. As another example of a vendor low-key screwing Framework in a…

In addition to no longer charging off 5V chargers (their first laptop could literally charge off a USB type A with no USB-PD), on the AMD 7040 I've got ~10% chance every time I plug it in to my dock that it will simply not start charging. Everything else will connect (display, USB) but power won't flow. Resolving that is as simple as unplugging and replugging in my laptop but if I don't notice until I'm in a video conference then it is a problem because my webcam, microphone, and headset are also going over that cable. Oh how I miss the OG 11th gen framework charging.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#184

Post by craftkiller »

cschep wrote: post #138
alt227 wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When your laptop dies what would you prefer, to be able to buy the specific broken part easily and replace it yourself or be forced to buy an entire new laptop?

I expect an optional update to not brick my laptop, and if it does, the company to fully replace it because they own the fact that they fucked up. Completely unrelated: Yes! I do prefer to be able to replace specific broken parts when they die. That sure doesn't apply to this situation though does it?

> That sure doesn't apply to this situation though does it?

It sort-of does. Naturally this situation can be resolved much cheaper with a flasher, but in this situation you absolutely have the option to replace the "broken" motherboard, while still keeping your screen, laptop chassis, battery, ram, SSD, wifi card, expansion cards, sound board, webcam. Another commenter said the board is available on Ebay for $270 which is going to be less than just the ram for a new laptop.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#185

Post by cschep »

Grombobulous wrote: post #141
jszymborski wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had Dell XPSs and Lenovo Thinkpads exclusively prior to Framework, and they all died by component failure. Sure, Dell will send a technician to your house and Lenovo has off-shore call centers, but the end result is the same: either buy an eye-wateringly expensive warranty that won't cover most failures or buy a new laptop. While I'm all for stronger consumer regulation when it comes to this stuff, on balance I…

Right, really what Framework is saying is "we don't have a repair center that tries to re-flash BIOS." Neither do the other manufacturers, it's just too much of an in-the-weeds repair that's not worth their technicians' time. The fact that the RAM isn't soldered is such a huge benefit here as well. The most recent 7040 series board that sold on eBay with no RAM or SSD included only cost $269. Even if the author decid…

> If you brick your MacBook Pro and take it to an Apple repair center, they might just be throwing your board in the trash and replacing it, charging you $500, and you get your computer back "repaired."

No one bricked their own laptop! They installed an update provided by the people that made the laptop! You bet your ass if installing software provided by apple bricked a macbook pro they would fix it for free. If they didn't it would be equally as unacceptable. Why are you defending a company that is doing the wrong thing? Framework is unequivocally wrong here.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#186

Post by throwuxiytayq »

anthonj wrote: post #170
throwuxiytayq wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a perfectly functioning main board If I understand correctly, the problem was that the board was the exact opposite of that. The post title uses the phrase “bricked”. I agree that FWs handling was pretty bad, but then again, what exactly is the proposed ideal-but-realistic solution they should have offered here?

"Bricked" is a bad term for system without a proper software/firmware update path. A LOT could have been done here to improve "repairability" (with quotes, because this is a software issue on a perfectly fine mainboard). A/B updates automatically recovering the bios is case of failed update, recovery from usb in case that somehow fails as well (InsydeH2O call it "crisis mode" I think). Lenovo support both. Dell too a…

I mean, sure, I agree it would be ideal if BIOS updates literally couldn’t fail - I meant to ask what they could have done to resolve this situation now.

But yes, lack of an USB bios recovery path is a pretty terrible design fault, and I’m surprised that they haven’t improved this by now.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#187

Post by artisinal »

craftkiller wrote: post #169
artisinal wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a €20 / 5 minute fix on the MacBook to swap out the USB daughterboard. The solution framework uses takes up a lot of space and doesn’t really help you if you short out the port or drop the laptop on its side.

As far as I can tell, Apple doesn't sell the daughterboards so you have to go spelunking for salvaged parts with your macbook. I can get all my first-party brand-new replacement parts at https://frame.work/marketplace .

It is available as a first party repair part for €16.20 via https://selfservicerepair.eu/

Apple part number is 923-03553

Also available third party via various retailers.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#188

Post by zvmaz »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #42
zvmaz wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a very different experience with the Framework team. The battery died (within the warranty period), I reached out to them, they asked some questions, then sent me a brand new one. Very satisfied with my Framework laptop and the customer support. I can't imagine buying another laptop.

This reply seems like a non-sequitor and does not respond to GPs concern. How would you feel if a BIOS update outside of warranty bricked your motherboard? I am sure you would not say the same.

I was responding to the person casting doubts on whether he/she should buy a Framework laptop by providing my own experience as a very happy customer. I still think he/she should go for a Framework.

As for BIOS updates outside warranty, I think it's always been risky for all brands. Maybe I'm wrong.

I don't think "non-sequitor" applies here.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#189

Post by whateverboat »

1saadcodes wrote: post #102

I really like what Framework is trying to do but this story is very hard to ignore. If a failed BIOS update can brick the machine, and the official solution is a CA$500+ motherboard (that's about $350+ USD I belieive), there's still a pretty big gap between being modular and being truly repairable Not to mention there are no "alternatives" that you can look into to purchase these replacements. You are essentially jus…

Yeah but this is true for every laptop vendor. Framework is not worse here, and yes, Framework is supposed to be better, but it cannot be better in everything at once. It is already better that you only need to buy a 350USD motherboard instead of a 1200 Euro laptop.

Re: Fixing a bricked Framework laptop

#190

Post by craftkiller »

artisinal wrote: post #187
craftkiller wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I can tell, Apple doesn't sell the daughterboards so you have to go spelunking for salvaged parts with your macbook. I can get all my first-party brand-new replacement parts at https://frame.work/marketplace .

It is available as a first party repair part for €16.20 via https://selfservicerepair.eu/ Apple part number is 923-03553 Also available third party via various retailers.

Ah I didn't know Apple put their repair parts under a different domain. I stand corrected!
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