No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam. • Hacker News Board

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#81

Post by eli » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:18 AM UTC

mikle wrote: post #71

eli wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but it applies to the many, many US-based tech companies. And I know Canada, Australia, and the UK have similar laws.

The thing is, how do you even prosecute it? Where the company is based? Where the web servers are based? Where the email servers are based? Where it was served? The email client's server location?

There are a lot of things wrong with the CAN SPAM Act, but this is not one of them. It applies to any company where the US can claim jurisdiction which, at the very least, includes every US based company. It does not matter how or where the emails are sent.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#82

Post by dhimes » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:19 AM UTC

xur17 wrote: post #77

lt wrote: post #7

It's in violation of the CAN-SPAM Act You can’t charge a fee, require the recipient to give you any personally identifying information beyond an email address, or make the recipient take any step other than sending a reply email or visiting a single page on an Internet website as a condition for honoring an opt-out request. http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus61-can-spam-act-complia...

So, that means I shouldn't have to login to my account to unsubscribe, correct? I find this annoying as I tend to click on the unsubscribe link from my phone, and not have the login details with me. I've seen several prominent companies that do this, including Mint earlier today.

You are correct.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#83

Post by michaelbuddy » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:20 AM UTC

mikle wrote: post #71

eli wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but it applies to the many, many US-based tech companies. And I know Canada, Australia, and the UK have similar laws.

The thing is, how do you even prosecute it? Where the company is based? Where the web servers are based? Where the email servers are based? Where it was served? The email client's server location?

the company can in the U.S. at least get hit with an FTC fine.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#84

Post by michaelbuddy » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:24 AM UTC

greggman wrote: post #41

My pet peeve, companies that don't unsubscribe immediately. Apple for example says they'll unsubscribe you in 10 days. Given all the other things a company's systems can do immediately this one strikes me as spammy

not 10 consecutive days of course. just 10 random days in the future of our choosing.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#85

Post by nwh » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:26 AM UTC

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #4

I'd like to add: 3. I shouldn't have to sign in to unsubscribe. 4. Don't auto-subscribe me to new notification types. (We're ALL looking at YOU LinkedIn.)

Twitter is horrible at that. Every few weeks they add a new notification type that you have to unsubscribe from, lest you get hit with another "newsletter" every few hours.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#86

Post by BrianEatWorld » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:34 AM UTC

I got stuck with marketing emails for my start-up and I take a bit of an issue with point one.

How is it the sender's fault if you can't remember why you signed up for an email?

As a matter of best practices, I do remind subscribers. However, it is also quite irritating to be marked as spam, when it was the user who signed up for my messages. By all means unsubscribe, but marking me as spam, especially because I use the highly spam averse Mailchimp is a mean thing to do. Its particularly mean if its just because you forgot what you signed up for.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#87

Post by darec1 » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:41 AM UTC

Ah, if you can unsubscribe with one click, maybe even without logging in. What stops evil Bert over there from unsubscribing you? Sure, there might be some (session) token involved, but that could have been sniffed or brute-forced.

Actually mailing lists do it right, have the subscriber confirm his action by clicking a link in a confirmation mail or such. I think that's called double confirmation.

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#88

Post by learn » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 2:57 AM UTC

stephen_g wrote: post #78

One other thing that massively annoys me - one of my email accounts is a gmail account with a fairly generic username, and people are constantly using it to sign up for things - and I'm getting some that have no way to unsubscribe (like BestBuy trying to get me to activate the antivirus subscription I never bought, or asking me to renew - I don't even live in the same country). So, if you're sending emails, please, p…

This happens to me all the time as well. As a "quick to anger" person this is the WORST thing you can do (un)intentionally!

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#89

Post by X-Istence » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 3:01 AM UTC

darec1 wrote: post #87

Ah, if you can unsubscribe with one click, maybe even without logging in. What stops evil Bert over there from unsubscribing you? Sure, there might be some (session) token involved, but that could have been sniffed or brute-forced. Actually mailing lists do it right, have the subscriber confirm his action by clicking a link in a confirmation mail or such. I think that's called double confirmation.

Generally when I unsubscribe from a newsletter they send me a message saying they are sorry to see me go, with a 1 click link to subscribe again ...

Re: No one-click unsubscribe? It's spam.

#90

Post by delackner » Mon, Dec 17, 2012, 3:04 AM UTC

BrianEatWorld wrote: post #86

I got stuck with marketing emails for my start-up and I take a bit of an issue with point one. How is it the sender's fault if you can't remember why you signed up for an email? As a matter of best practices, I do remind subscribers. However, it is also quite irritating to be marked as spam, when it was the user who signed up for my messages. By all means unsubscribe, but marking me as spam, especially because I use…

Just because your boss asked you to do something that many people HATE, doesn't make it better.

People handing over their email address in exchange for user registration or to gain access to a trial version of your product are not interested in receiving sporadic advertising for the next N years.

People are inundated by unwanted email every day, from companies that claim, like Dracula, "but you said I could come inside." Some people don't mind, but some of your target customers will already have very negative reactions to ANY marketing email, so it is incredibly important that you go out of your way to make it clear that you are trying to communicate something that will benefit the recipient, not just a sales pitch you can justify legally sending them.