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Gemini 3.7 Flash

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Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#241

Post by Rover222 »

eis wrote: post #117
yassa9 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

its essentially the same model being trained continuously 24/7 with the company periodically publishing just a new checkpoint each new checkpoint can benefit from better reasoning training, RL on specific tasks and more synthetic data So why do they seem to release around the same time ? my guess is because they time major releases around quarterly earnings, investor meetings and other important business milestones.…

Sure, they are just checkpoints, that much I guess is obvious. The question is why did they not do frequent releases like this before and why are they making significant jumps in benchmarks so fast and all these companies suddenly falling into that pattern? Earning reports are not to come until end of October, that's not it.

possibly the beginning of the recursive feedback as models begin to aid in their own improvement? especially algorithmic improvements, which seems to have a lot of wide open space for gains

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#242

Post by qlte »

1bm wrote: post #228
krat0sprakhar wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you help me understand how it is hard to get an API key from Google? You just head on over to http://aistudio.google.com/api-keys and create a key... not any different from platform.openai.com? Disclaimer: I work in Google so it might be that this link is not publicly well known

You need to create a Google Cloud project to create an api key and when you try to create one you very often get error messages like: “Failed to create project, The request is suspicious. Please try again” or “ You do not have permission to create a key in this project”. You can then navigate multiple screens in GCP to make it work but it’s a hassle compared to any other provider (OAI/Ant/OpenRouter or any of the Chi…

I didn't have that issue back when I originally created my API keys a couple years ago. Just out of curiosity I switched to a different Google account that had never interacted with AI Studio and never used Google Cloud console.

It was literally two clicks, and didn't even leave the page: the dialog asked to create a project and type in a name, I did that, clicked submit and then it was selected as the default project. One more click and I had the free tier API key.

Not saying you didn't have that experience at the time, but personally I have had zero issues with AI Studio and consider it the most dead simple/fastest dev dashboard to get started compared to the others like OpenAI/Anthropic (thanks to Google's free tier that lets you skip billing setup annoyances just to play around with Gemini).

Despite what HN threads (that are also frequently confused and talking about GCP instead) portray as universal/widespread issues or the process being complex and time consuming somehow.

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#243

Post by wongarsu »

simonw wrote: post #141

The "introductory pricing" for this 3.7 Flash model is really weird. It's scheduled to double in price on December 31, 2026, but who would anticipate still using this model five months from now? Especially since 3.6 Flash came out just three weeks ago! My first effort with default thinking level produced an ambitious pelican, let down by a flawed bicycle: https://tools.simonwillison.net/markdown-svg-renderer#url=ht..…

At $work we still have some places using Opus 4.5. Even places using Qwen 2.5-VL, which is now 18 months old. It works, and upgrading is work (we'd have to validate the new model performs comparable in all the corner cases that currently work just fine)

Those kind of workloads would be hit by an end of introductory pricing. And it's exactly the kind of cases that are not very price sensitive. Where we are price sensitive we track new model releases closely, where we aren't other issues get priority as long as llm performance is good enough

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#244

Post by krychu »

jjcm wrote: post #133
jjcm wrote: post #106

Here's a image->html test. Gemini has always swung above its weight class for vision work, so I'm always eager to try it with this. Original images: https://image.non.io/neonRamenDesigns.webp Gemini 3.7 build: https://html.non.io/neonRamenGemini3.7 Opus 5 build for comparison: https://html.non.io/neonRamen Opus is still best in class for this, but it's worth noting how well Gemini 3.7 does vs a more comparable LLM pr…

Other thoughts: I really think Google has fallen behind here. Even as a high speed offering (this build took ~7min, which is pretty good!), it wont be able to claim dominance for long with cerebras announcing the Sol preview today: https://www.cerebras.ai/blog/accelerating-gpt-5-6-sol-ultraf... . It's not a bad model by any means, but I just don't know what situation I'd reach for 3.7 Flash first for. Google really n…

> but I just don't know what situation I'd reach for 3.7 Flash

You reach for it every time you do a Google search

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#245

Post by kyruzic »

So at this point new models seem to only care about one task, software development. This really was not the original pitch of ai and I do not see how it justifies the insane spend or valuations it has produced.

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#246

Post by ur-whale »

krat0sprakhar wrote: post #215
jjcm wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other thoughts: I really think Google has fallen behind here. Even as a high speed offering (this build took ~7min, which is pretty good!), it wont be able to claim dominance for long with cerebras announcing the Sol preview today: https://www.cerebras.ai/blog/accelerating-gpt-5-6-sol-ultraf... . It's not a bad model by any means, but I just don't know what situation I'd reach for 3.7 Flash first for. Google really n…

Can you help me understand how it is hard to get an API key from Google? You just head on over to http://aistudio.google.com/api-keys and create a key... not any different from platform.openai.com? Disclaimer: I work in Google so it might be that this link is not publicly well known

> Can you help me understand how it is hard to get an API key from Google?

Using Google products in general is an effing nightmare as soon as you have to give them money.

The one thing you want in a business is to remove friction when people want to give you money, a concept Google has never been able to understand.

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#247

Post by ur-whale »

Why does Google keep announcing these subpar models?

What am I missing?

They can't seem to be able to produce a frontier model, fine.

Just be quiet about it and work hard until you manage to put one together.

[EDIT]: Come to think of it. Maybe they're trying to build the Toyota corolla of AI ... let's see if that wins them the battle long term. I personally doubt it.

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#248

Post by Revanche1367 »

kyruzic wrote: post #245

So at this point new models seem to only care about one task, software development. This really was not the original pitch of ai and I do not see how it justifies the insane spend or valuations it has produced.

Think of the potential layoffs of highly paid employees!

But, I think it’s also based on what they are being used for, most LLM users are still mainly SWEs or similar as I understand and there’s a ton of data to train them for coding.

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#249

Post by deadmutex »

jerf wrote: post #217
deadmutex wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The "let's make money by selling/renting out TPUs" faction has won and the "let's make money by training and selling a frontier model" faction has lost. Citation needed. also, why can't a massive company do two things?

"why can't a massive company do two things?" It's a variation of opportunity cost. A company that has an opportunity to take $1 and make $1.50 on it can't justify an opportunity to spend $1 and make $1.25, even though a less profitable company may make a good living on that. When considering capital allocation, Google has to consider the opportunity cost of investing more into their highly lucrative ads business. Ano…

This is extremely simplified, and not realistic. One counter to this is markowitz portfolio theory, or "diversification effect".

Re: Gemini 3.7 Flash

#250

Post by SyneRyder »

jjcm wrote: post #224
krat0sprakhar wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you help me understand how it is hard to get an API key from Google? You just head on over to http://aistudio.google.com/api-keys and create a key... not any different from platform.openai.com? Disclaimer: I work in Google so it might be that this link is not publicly well known

Disclaimer that I haven't tried this since January, so things may have changed in the last 7mo, but this was my experience at that time: https://x.com/pwnies/status/2010523020629274723 At a high level though, as a rule of thumb Google assumes that they're serving companies at Google scale first, and at a human scale second. For other companies it's the opposite. Generally what that means is the first experience you g…

Similar experience here, for what it's worth, though I didn't get as far as you. I basically just stopped and didn't bother - it was easier to go through OpenRouter than spend more energy on it.

Also:

> Google assumes that they're serving companies at Google scale first

So much this. I'm currently grandfathered in until the end of the year on Google's Search API, but the $35,000 they want to continue usage of my < 1000 personal searches per month, not going to happen. It has honestly been easier to use Anthropic to help me build my own search index & crawling infrastructure than deal with Google.

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