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Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

nytimes.com

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Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#11

Post by PyWoody »

ButlerianJihad wrote: post #9
King-Aaron wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I frankly do not trust a single word or single opinion of a person that doesn't see the immense problem with this kind of surveillance technology. They are either not arguing in good faith, making me question their entire agenda, or are simply not equipped to understand the implications.

Have you ever seen Wim Wenders’ original, “Wings of Desire”? I heartily recommend it to anyone who is irrationally opposed to state surveillance, (or, by extension if you simply resent the idea of an omniscient God) just because it is an achingly beautiful and true film that proposes a more reasonable viewpoint.

I'll bite: How is a movie about an angel falling in love with a trapeze artist pro state surveillance?

Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#13

Post by lowbloodsugar »

wwarner wrote: post #8

Unpopular opinion: I’m fine with cameras if they can be shown to solve crimes and lower the crime rate. No, I’m not ok with ICE surveillance, or secret police punishing free thinkers, but the extreme anti position simply cedes the technology to the authoritarians. So basically, if you’re promising London safety and the freedom and safeguards of the UK, I’m all for it!

>So basically, if you’re promising London safety and the freedom and safeguards of the UK, I’m all for it!

Is this sarcasm? A good friend is a criminal defense barrister and his opinion does not match yours on the justice perspective. Meanwhile two good friends were hospitalized in two separate incidents in London. Just random violence. "Nothing we can do" said coppers. Daily you tube videos of pickpockets targeting tourists. etc.

Unless you are very rich, London's surveillance state isn't helping you.

Bonus: the Mayor of London and the Mayor of the City of London are different people, because the City of London is a semi-independent state with different police force. IIRC the Tower of London, Tower Bridge and St Pauls are within the "square mile".

Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#14

Post by King-Aaron »

ButlerianJihad wrote: post #9
King-Aaron wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I frankly do not trust a single word or single opinion of a person that doesn't see the immense problem with this kind of surveillance technology. They are either not arguing in good faith, making me question their entire agenda, or are simply not equipped to understand the implications.

Have you ever seen Wim Wenders’ original, “Wings of Desire”? I heartily recommend it to anyone who is irrationally opposed to state surveillance, (or, by extension if you simply resent the idea of an omniscient God) just because it is an achingly beautiful and true film that proposes a more reasonable viewpoint.

> Have you ever seen Wim Wenders’ original, “Wings of Desire”?

Literally never heard of it, and honestly I'm not sure I care to if your response to my comment is thinking I'm "irrationally opposed to state surveillance".

Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#17

Post by PyWoody »

King-Aaron wrote: post #14
ButlerianJihad wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever seen Wim Wenders’ original, “Wings of Desire”? I heartily recommend it to anyone who is irrationally opposed to state surveillance, (or, by extension if you simply resent the idea of an omniscient God) just because it is an achingly beautiful and true film that proposes a more reasonable viewpoint.

> Have you ever seen Wim Wenders’ original, “Wings of Desire”? Literally never heard of it, and honestly I'm not sure I care to if your response to my comment is thinking I'm "irrationally opposed to state surveillance".

Wings of Desire is a beautiful movie. It's probably my all time favorite. Bruno Ganz is sensational in it and Peter Falk has some great scenes, too.

Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#18

Post by vinyl7 »

tehlike wrote: post #6
Morromist wrote: post #3

Its commonly said by people who seem to love this tech that we don't get to have a right to privacy in public spaces (anywhere but shut inside our houses with the window blinds drawn) but it appears now we also don't have a right not to be surveilled intensely, our every movement recorded, tracked and noted down permanantly, analysed with Algorithms & scrutenized for potential crimes. Land of freedom they say.

People who support second amendment to stand against government tyranny love to give government power to do tyranny.

This is an opposite problem. Flock is a private unelected unaccountable corporation. That's exactly of right leaning libertarians want, for some reason.

Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#19

Post by rconti »

Morromist wrote: post #3

Its commonly said by people who seem to love this tech that we don't get to have a right to privacy in public spaces (anywhere but shut inside our houses with the window blinds drawn) but it appears now we also don't have a right not to be surveilled intensely, our every movement recorded, tracked and noted down permanantly, analysed with Algorithms & scrutenized for potential crimes. Land of freedom they say.

They say "you don't have an expectation of privacy driving a car on a public road/your license plate is public info". They don't address the fact that these are cameras, not ALPRs. They collect vehicle metadata. We have no way of knowing what other metadata they collect but don't "use". We'll have no idea when the software update goes out that adds facial recognition if it's not already there.

Re: Flock Cameras Can Track Every Car in America. Police Love Them. Citizens Don't

#20

Post by rconti »

wwarner wrote: post #8

Unpopular opinion: I’m fine with cameras if they can be shown to solve crimes and lower the crime rate. No, I’m not ok with ICE surveillance, or secret police punishing free thinkers, but the extreme anti position simply cedes the technology to the authoritarians. So basically, if you’re promising London safety and the freedom and safeguards of the UK, I’m all for it!

> the extreme anti position simply cedes the technology to the authoritarians

I have no idea what this means. It seems to me the extreme "yes, please surveil me" position cedes the technology to the authoritarians.

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