What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers • Hacker News Board

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#951

Post by zmmmmm » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:10 PM UTC

I will say here that there are meaningful jobs that especially tech people can engage with. There are gigantic unsolved problems. Climate change, cancer, thousands of rare disorders with no therapy or even good diagnostics. And many of these fields have actual roles for technical people to fill and usually can't find highly qualified people to do them because a software eng salary is far out of reach of the average research funding.

Before burning out, retiring or checking out altogether, I really recommend people look at the concept of halving your salary and taking a job that still employs your skills but is directly attached to actual meaning.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#952

Post by Exoristos » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:29 PM UTC

estearum wrote: post #760

Animats wrote: post #221

Addressing the question in the title, "What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers", look at what happened to printers. That was a good skilled trade for centuries. Then it just went away. Phototypesetting took the high volume end. Desktop publishing took the low end. Computer-controlled presses took press operators. And then the newspaper business died. I've heard homeless former printers…

Surprised no one has made the extremely obvious observation that it took literal centuries for printing technology to eliminate the trade of printers, which could not have possibly have employed more than 0.01% of people at its peak. Compared to the potential obsolescence of 40% to 60% of the US workforce over the course of 10 - 20 years? You can argue about whether the obsolescence is real or not, but if it is , the…

Most of it actually took about five years, as the manufacturing side of it was outsourced to China and the computer side to India. I was there. Management told us it was "because of 9/11." R.R. Donnelley was one of the world's largest manufacturing companies, a Fortune 50 company -- became a penny stock in a decade or so.

The technologies GP mentions didn't end commercial print -- they were all heavily in use _by_ commercial print.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#953

Post by Exoristos » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:30 PM UTC

Exoristos wrote: post #952

estearum wrote: post #760

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surprised no one has made the extremely obvious observation that it took literal centuries for printing technology to eliminate the trade of printers, which could not have possibly have employed more than 0.01% of people at its peak. Compared to the potential obsolescence of 40% to 60% of the US workforce over the course of 10 - 20 years? You can argue about whether the obsolescence is real or not, but if it is , the…

Most of it actually took about five years, as the manufacturing side of it was outsourced to China and the computer side to India. I was there. Management told us it was "because of 9/11." R.R. Donnelley was one of the world's largest manufacturing companies, a Fortune 50 company -- became a penny stock in a decade or so. The technologies GP mentions didn't end commercial print -- they were all heavily in use _by_ co…

Oh and the actual driving mechanism was vulture capitalist takeover.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#954

Post by Tomis02 » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:30 PM UTC

zmmmmm wrote: post #951

I will say here that there are meaningful jobs that especially tech people can engage with. There are gigantic unsolved problems. Climate change, cancer, thousands of rare disorders with no therapy or even good diagnostics. And many of these fields have actual roles for technical people to fill and usually can't find highly qualified people to do them because a software eng salary is far out of reach of the average r…

It's insane that jobs involving cancer research pay half of what a regular VC-funded web company pays.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#955

Post by jongjong » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:41 PM UTC

salawat wrote: post #930

jongjong wrote: post #827

I think the part that's hard to absorb is that software engineering was a brutal path. You had to restructure your entire identity, ego, personality, social relationships around that career choice. People didn't expect their career to last forever, but they thought it was a ticket out to gain autonomy. Back in 2010-ish, many developers thought that, in the future, they'd all be running their own systems and servicing…

Almost like all western civilization is architected to ensure the benefit of a few at the expense of the many by design doesn't it? If not by design than by emergent consequence of how it executes.

Yes, the full extractive structure is much more visible now. Used to be discussed as "conspiracy theory" but now it's obvious that such structure exists and it doesn't require any conspiracy; shared incentives suffice. So yes, I would say that this structure is emergent.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#956

Post by shimman » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:52 PM UTC

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #853

THX1137 wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> forcing me to go out every day and talk to human beings face to face, even just little things like making sure I was showered and dressed every day This part is strange to me. I've worked from home for about 10 years and I've never once had an issue with twice-daily showering, meeting people face-to-face, going out for coffee, going outdoors, going to the gym, etc. The fact I can just go sit in a park, on a hiking…

I am very jealous of you.

Unless you live in a self isolated monastery you have neighbors and the only person stopping you from making friends is yourself.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#957

Post by rootusrootus » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 10:58 PM UTC

parpfish wrote: post #558

rootusrootus wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like we're probably going to have to give up something, most probably anonymity, to get back to anything like sanity. We'll see communities that are militantly anti-AI where it's hard to get in and easy to get kicked out, and it will probably cost money and require you to divulge who you really are. It could still be semi-anonymous at the user level but not at the administrative level. I'd like to see somethin…

Those plans might work to give a nice sane internet experience to the folks that are willing to put in some money and effort. But most people will still opt to stay on the slop-filled web because it’s free and because they like being angry. And as long as they stay the societal problems that stem from the toxic internet will live on.

I agree, it will filter for a certain kind of person, and most probably the people who are not a problem on today's Internet. If we cannot tamp down the filth that comes along with emphatic anonymity, then at least we can create some places without it. I'm getting to the point where I may pull the plug on my Internet as soon as I retire. Kinda hate to do that, because I remember when it didn't suck (at least not everywhere).

IMO once upon a time Facebook could have been that place, though maybe that ship has sailed now. There was a time when I thought they could choose to offer a premium experience for anyone willing to pay and there would have been a small but real subset of users who would go for it. Charge $25/mo (which I believe is approximately what they make off a normal US user) in return for zero ads, zero algorithm, complete control over the experience. Add another level above that which includes actively moderated members-only discussion forums.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#958

Post by johnnyanmac » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 11:29 PM UTC

andai wrote: post #313

marginalia_nu wrote: post #54

Saw a meme on mastodon the other day contrasting people of the '90s going online to escape from offline reality, and people of the '20s going offline to escape from online reality. There's something to that. I think a big part of it is just how incredibly toxic the web has become. If you spend any time online, as most tech workers do, you have exceptional resiliency if you're able to stay sane and level headed. Going…

Well it used to be that the government's job was to keep morale high. At some point that seems to have inverted. The coalition-of-Molochs appears to be finding it much more profitable to make everyone want to kill themselves. (Not sure if that's a great long-term strategy, but they seem to have thought this through.)

> but they seem to have thought this through

If there's one thing I'm confident of in my government, it's that they certainly did not think this through. Thus highlighting the core issue.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#959

Post by johnnyanmac » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 11:35 PM UTC

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #162

This dropped off the front page in the time I read it, I assume because of the controversial gate that favors upvotes to comments (which I am making worse by replying to others). It is a shame, because this really resonated with me. I've been working in tech for over 20 years now in various roles, and this is the least I have cared about it. I used to want to get better, and was constantly excited about learning new…

> Talking to him gives me hope for the future, the kids will be alright.

Not if current leadership has any say in it (and they do). I'm never really one who thinks "this generation is screwed" in the same way people go "kids these days". But I still use such sentiment. Because the generations before us did the exact opposite of leaving a seed for a tree they will never sit under. They are in fact trying to burn the forest down and kids will inherit the fire.

The kids will adjust, once the adults strop strangling them. Which at this point will probably need nature to work its course.

Re: What happens if an entire class of workers loses faith in their careers

#960

Post by qwerpy » Sat, Aug 08, 2026, 11:38 PM UTC

hellohello2 wrote: post #470

marginalia_nu wrote: post #54

Saw a meme on mastodon the other day contrasting people of the '90s going online to escape from offline reality, and people of the '20s going offline to escape from online reality. There's something to that. I think a big part of it is just how incredibly toxic the web has become. If you spend any time online, as most tech workers do, you have exceptional resiliency if you're able to stay sane and level headed. Going…

Yeah I'm not sure what happened but Reddit in particular is beyond saving, and I'm not saying it was ever great. I think we simply don't know how to create online communities that make any sense yet. I'd rather have second hand smoke than any more algorithmic "engagement" maximization at this point.

When people here complain about HN becoming Reddit, they get that snide HN guideline thrown at them. I mostly refuse to abide, and continue to call out and downvote/flag Reddit-tier comments. Fighting the redditization of HN is what will save this place.