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US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

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Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#271

Post by probably_wrong »

brandonagr2 wrote: post #242
senderista wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel more compassion for the innocent people they killed and it's not even close.

Which part of "attack enemies" implies they were targeting innocent people?

Some searching led me to this report from an NGO called "AirWars" [1] which, in connection with The Guardian, reports that "at least 22,679, and potentially as many as 48,308 civilians, have been likely killed by US strikes".

You can't bomb an apartment without also hitting the neighbors. And while we know the US has the the technology to hit a car driver without (physically) hurting the passenger, we also know that this is not the type of technology deployed regularly.

I don't think a drone operator would be naive enough to believe that they are killing exclusively military targets and no one else.

[1] https://airwars.org/tens-of-thousands-of-civilians-likely-ki...

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#272

Post by senderista »

constantius wrote: post #206
senderista wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel more compassion for the innocent people they killed and it's not even close.

A lot of people on HN have either served in the US mil or are sympathetic, and have successfully solved their cognitive dissonance about killing 10k people for 1 soldier. But you're right, whoever they killed was most often either a civilian, someone defending their country, or someone forced to defend their country from an invader. While the US soldiers kill either because they believe in the crazy narratives pushed…

I admire Aaron Bushnell, but that page unironically uses phrases like "Satanic Talmudic supremacy"

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#273

Post by fryanyway_swe »

senderista wrote: post #193
kstrauser wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was a big thing for drone people based out of Eppley AFB in Omaha. Wake up, drive to work, attack enemies, drive home, sit there eating dinner with your family trying to pretend you didn’t kill someone and can’t talk about it. Combat troops get to lean on each other after a firefight: “dude, good shot. That guy was about to get us!” You get validation that you did something to safe you and your friends, and it’s…

I feel more compassion for the innocent people they killed and it's not even close.

[flagged]

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#274

Post by fryanyway_swe »

constantius wrote: post #206
senderista wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel more compassion for the innocent people they killed and it's not even close.

A lot of people on HN have either served in the US mil or are sympathetic, and have successfully solved their cognitive dissonance about killing 10k people for 1 soldier. But you're right, whoever they killed was most often either a civilian, someone defending their country, or someone forced to defend their country from an invader. While the US soldiers kill either because they believe in the crazy narratives pushed…

>someone defending their country

Can be used to justify anything.

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#275

Post by senderista »

victorbjorklund wrote: post #258
senderista wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel more compassion for the innocent people they killed and it's not even close.

They probably didn’t kill just innocent people.

Did I ever claim they only killed innocent people?

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#276

Post by senderista »

probably_wrong wrote: post #271
brandonagr2 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which part of "attack enemies" implies they were targeting innocent people?

Some searching led me to this report from an NGO called "AirWars" [1] which, in connection with The Guardian, reports that "at least 22,679, and potentially as many as 48,308 civilians, have been likely killed by US strikes". You can't bomb an apartment without also hitting the neighbors. And while we know the US has the the technology to hit a car driver without (physically) hurting the passenger, we also know that…

Israel will happily flatten a whole apartment complex to get one guy.

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#277

Post by derektank »

Loquebantur wrote: post #254
CircuitSeuss wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe… Things are really fucked right now. I agree that this is an abnormal number of suicides- I don't think anyone is disputing that. I disagree with your suggestion of “housecleaning” though. I would speculate that the answer is simplier: DoD “Hacker stuff” kills people. And worse. At scale. The psychological stressors of intelligence work alone is real and extremely high; Cyber Command’s role is not just to kn…

The US intelligence community engaging in murdering suspected "weak links" in order to "send a message", "clean the house" etc. is a regularly recurring phenomenon. The fiction, that intelligence community (among many other places in US government) was some harbor of angelic superior morality, capable of restraining themselves in spite of total lack of effective oversight is certainly "simple". That doesn't make it t…

USCYBERCOM is not the IC, it’s DoD. The majority of CYBERCOM tasked units are cyber protection teams, primarily focused on securing the DoD’s own vast and bloated network infrastructure from attack by foreign adversaries. The rest are split between hunt forward teams, cyber support teams, and the combat mission teams, the latter of which are the only ones that conduct offensive cyberspace operations. This is all literally 101 stuff

https://www.cybercom.mil/Media/News/Article/3206393/cyber-10...

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#278

Post by MaxikCZ »

Hilliard_Ohiooo wrote: post #211
rdtsc wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the most damaging part of direct combat is watching people that you consider to be family die or be maimed. I've heard from various places over the years (documentaries, friends) that soldiers really fight for their comrades at the end of the day. As in when asked "why are you here fighting" if they are in front of a news crews or something where they have to say "we're bringing democracy to ..." they'll just say s…

I was in the military and in my experience people that chose to go into war zones, it's optional, are fucked in the head and literally enjoy killing people, I've seen it a dozen times. They want to kill.

Id recommend anyone to give "Generation Kill" series a watch.

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#279

Post by fryanyway_swe »

mx7zysuj4xew wrote: post #229
jckahn wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you believe that "death to America" chants should not be taken seriously?

Yeah To the younger generations it's just political theatre and gets laughed at as being the equivalent of boomer cringe

[flagged]

Re: US Military's cyber command unit grapples with cluster of deaths by suicide

#280

Post by JackFr »

netsharc wrote: post #250
brandonagr2 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which part of "attack enemies" implies they were targeting innocent people?

Obama's department of defense classified every male between 16-65 hit by drone attacks as enemy combatant until proven otherwise... So the war crimes are bipartisan. And I write this as someone who likes Obama.

GWB got heat for extralegal extraordinary renditions. Obama solved it by just killing them. I guess we can’t ask the dead guys if they’d prefer to go to Guantanamo.
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