Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
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Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#2[flagged]
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#3He is wrong and right. They should be connected to the Internet when they aren't 30 year old PLCs ripe for abuse. Until then, cut the data lines and do water monitoring the old way.
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#4He is wrong and right. They should be connected to the Internet when they aren't 30 year old PLCs ripe for abuse. Until then, cut the data lines and do water monitoring the old way.
If it’s connected, it’s compromised. Or will be.
Folly to think otherwise.
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#5There are many wireless pump-and-reservoir systems that while not internet connected, use insecure RF links. These local RF (and casting a wider net, Bluetooth) interfaces are also ripe for abuse.
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#6>Other countries start securing their water
>nsa: what no, stop that
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#7He is wrong and right. They should be connected to the Internet when they aren't 30 year old PLCs ripe for abuse. Until then, cut the data lines and do water monitoring the old way.
If it’s connected, it’s compromised. Or will be. Folly to think otherwise.
Keeping things up to date and holding critical infrastructure to higher standards than consumer tech is not a bad idea.
Taking things offline and properly airgapped can also work, but wouldn't the cost of that exceed making specialized things and maintaining them?
We got into this situation due to cost, not ignorance. Both choices are higher cost than putting ancient devices on the internet.
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#8Earlier quoted context omitted.
If it’s connected, it’s compromised. Or will be. Folly to think otherwise.
Keeping things up to date and holding critical infrastructure to higher standards than consumer tech is not a bad idea. Taking things offline and properly airgapped can also work, but wouldn't the cost of that exceed making specialized things and maintaining them? We got into this situation due to cost, not ignorance. Both choices are higher cost than putting ancient devices on the internet.
You can't have both secure infrastructure and Internet exposed infrastructure. I don't know if I'd frame it as incompetence, but it does seem firmly outside the capabilities of current engineering practice.
If you need a computer system to be actually secure, rule #0 is absolutely ensure it cannot receive unauthorized inputs of any kind (airgapped, big Faraday cage, JB Weld all the ports, big scary guys with guns, redundant locks, blast doors, etc). Otherwise you've lost against any sufficiently motivated adversary.
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#9Don't put your PLCs directly on the internet. In fact most industrial stuff is very not made to be directly connected to the internet. But interpose a firewall+VPN solution and you might be ok, if done competently.
And remote access to hardware definitely makes management and maintenance a lot easier and quicker. (else you need to drive out for every minor issue)
Re: Water system controllers don't belong on the internet, says ex-NSA chief
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
If it’s connected, it’s compromised. Or will be. Folly to think otherwise.
Keeping things up to date and holding critical infrastructure to higher standards than consumer tech is not a bad idea. Taking things offline and properly airgapped can also work, but wouldn't the cost of that exceed making specialized things and maintaining them? We got into this situation due to cost, not ignorance. Both choices are higher cost than putting ancient devices on the internet.
I think you're assuming that updating software/hardware to more recent versions is sufficient to prevent a nation-state from wreaking havoc, and I'm not sure that's true. When it comes to something as critical as water infrastructure, maybe just don't connect the system to the internet on the off chance that you're wrong.