the real war the US should be fighting
Maybe after the US annexes Greenland, for some reason.
Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
61–70 of 108 posts
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#62So you're forced to join a gang and fight their rival gangs, or you form your own gang equipped with rifles and grenades ready to commit violence, so that you can fight against joining that gang, or any other gang. Either way you're in a violent gang. I guess I'd rather have the state maintain a monopoly on violence.
These gangs are states. We can tell this because they have monopolies on violence.
Reminds me of when ISIS was at its peak a few years ago and the BBC and all other news in the UK would always prefix it with “the so-called Islamic State”.
Like… no, it was a state. It had borders, it had a monopoly on violence within those borders, it collected taxes, it provided some public services.
Whether it offended the BBC’s sensibilities or not, it was a state
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#63These self defense groups sound great until you think about all the problems with vigilante groups. Also they have a history of turning into cartels. That and all things being equal I suspect most of the people in these groups would rather not be fighting.
What choice do they have? This is not your usual vigilante group. This is a reaction to an overwhelming force of criminal gangs killing citizens and the government being powerless to stop them.
> This is a reaction to an overwhelming force of criminal gangs killing citizens and the government being powerless to stop them.
Is the Mexican government, with their tens of billions in military spending, actually "powerless" to stop these gangs? I very much doubt it.
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#64Our heroic self defense group. Their brutish narco terrorist cartel.
I'd recommend reading the history of Autodefensas and FARC/FLN in Colombia.
Anti-Drug militant groups have a habit of turning into drug lords as well.
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#65So you're forced to join a gang and fight their rival gangs, or you form your own gang equipped with rifles and grenades ready to commit violence, so that you can fight against joining that gang, or any other gang. Either way you're in a violent gang. I guess I'd rather have the state maintain a monopoly on violence.
I agree, not all violence is the same.
But further, perhaps our sense of morality atrophies when we concede the idea of just violence (just as in "justice") only to the state.
I presume those fighting the cartels might have more of a developed sense of civic pride and duty than anyone in a more stable place. Perhaps I'm wrong though
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#66[dead]
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#67Mexico has been like that for decades, I believe it's top 1 priority for most Mexicans yet it's still not fixed. What gives ? At some point when your government is so corrupt, you got to take weapon and organize yourself. It's sad.
>> Mexico has been like that for decades.
Back in the 60's and 70's my Dad worked or Lockheed Martin. He made frequent trips to Mexico to work with engineering teams there on projects he was working on. It only took him one trip to realize how corrupt the police were.
He had parked outside of his hotel with his rental car. Came out. It was surrounded by Policia. They told him he couldn't park here. "Sure thing, I'll move it and not park here again." "You don't understand gringo, you have to pay the parking fine now." He caught on, and asked how much it would cost to just park here, you know, rent this spot instead of paying their fine? The cops gave him an amount and he paid it and they left him alone the rest of the week he was there. He told me a bunch of other stories about the corruption there, not just the cops. It was pretty eye opening to hear some of these.
The corruption can't be fixed. Its engrained in the system. It was rampant fifty years ago, there is no fixing it - its completely normalized now. The cartels simply used the system against itself to gain total control and power.
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#68So you're forced to join a gang and fight their rival gangs, or you form your own gang equipped with rifles and grenades ready to commit violence, so that you can fight against joining that gang, or any other gang. Either way you're in a violent gang. I guess I'd rather have the state maintain a monopoly on violence.
> I guess I'd rather have the state maintain a monopoly on violence.
Like the Taliban?
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#69[flagged]
I was under the impression ferrying migrants over the border and avocados were almost as big revenue streams as the drugs. Et tu, avocado toast and gardener?
No, not really, it's two orders of magnitude smaller overall. Drugs, gold (from illegal mines in the Amazon) and weapons (from US lost military stock/police seizure mostly) drive cartels economy (in that order last time I checked, pre-covid).
Human trafficking and racketeering are for smaller, more local gangs. Most illegal immigrants cross the border legally and overstay, and racketeering have a scale issue. It might have changed recently but I don't see how.
Re: Civilians under siege by Mexican cartel fight back with AK-47s, grenades
#70So you're forced to join a gang and fight their rival gangs, or you form your own gang equipped with rifles and grenades ready to commit violence, so that you can fight against joining that gang, or any other gang. Either way you're in a violent gang. I guess I'd rather have the state maintain a monopoly on violence.
I agree, not all violence is the same. But further, perhaps our sense of morality atrophies when we concede the idea of just violence (just as in "justice") only to the state. I presume those fighting the cartels might have more of a developed sense of civic pride and duty than anyone in a more stable place. Perhaps I'm wrong though
> But further, perhaps our sense of morality atrophies when we concede the idea of just violence (just as in "justice") only to the state.
> I presume those fighting the cartels might have more of a developed sense of civic pride and duty than anyone in a more stable place. Perhaps I'm wrong though
100%. You can either become familiar with violence and temper it, or you are simply subject to violence by anyone that wishes it upon you.
For most of the Western world we grow up as "house cats", but that isn't the case in much of the world.