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Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

cnn.com

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Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#121

Post by palmotea »

bpodgursky wrote: post #114
palmotea wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The point of industrial capacity is a positive externality for the country not that it makes someone's backyard prettier. Yeah, that' true. What's the problem with building them in Atherton, then? The nation will get the same positive externalities if they're built there. Hell, build ones ringing the houses of Sam Altman and Dario Amodei. Larry Ellison has a whole island that could be filled with data centers. Seem…

Technologists would be thrilled to build them in California? This is such a weird and fake criticism, California has driven manufacturing and industry out of the state, SF tech companies don't want to build in Nevada, they are forced to by regulations. Like, none of the things you proposed doing are legal in the jurisdictions mentioned. It is NOT LEGAL for Sam Altman to build a hyperscale data center in his backyard.…

> Technologists would be thrilled to build them in California?

I'm certain none of the people actually ordering these things would be thrilled to have them anywhere near where they actually live. If they could build them in California, they'd find some rural area or poor neighborhood to drop them in.

> Like, none of the things you proposed doing are legal in the jurisdictions mentioned. It is NOT LEGAL for Sam Altman to build a hyperscale data center in his backyard. It is NOT LEGAL for Larry Ellison to build a hyperscale data center on his island.

Oh, how very convenient for them.

How about they sic their lawyers on California to make it legal, instead of some rural county government? Get an initiative on the ballot rezoning a billionaires' actual places of residence and adjacent land for datacenter construction, and flood the airwaves supporting it. Make some campaign contributions!

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#122

Post by rurp »

The most surprising thing to me about the data center backlash is how surprised a lot of people in tech are about it. The public tradeoffs seem pretty terrible from the perspective of folks who aren't spending all day enamored with agentic coding loops, aka normal Americans. There have been a number of utility related scandals, with residential power bills doubling as data centers go in and water being illegally taken for their use. In the online arena most people are exposed to AI as social media slop and dumb chatbot features being crammed into every piece of software they use.

Long term, the goal for this buildout is to drive millions of people out of their livelihood. But maybe a rogue AI will go nuts before then and become even more catastrophic.

So people are looking around, seeing their physical space being worsened in order to make their digital lives worse, with the possibility of much more misery to come. No kidding they aren't a fan.

It's interesting that the companies building these haven't even tried to smooth over the public relations until recently. I get it, this is all terribly exciting for VCs and a subset of techies, but their inability to even comprehend the objections shows what an extreme bubble they are in. The rest of the country gets a vote, and snidely dismissing everyone else as a knee jerk NIMBY, or Chinese shill, or illogical moron isn't going to convince anyone.

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#123

Post by red-iron-pine »

rurp wrote: post #122

The most surprising thing to me about the data center backlash is how surprised a lot of people in tech are about it. The public tradeoffs seem pretty terrible from the perspective of folks who aren't spending all day enamored with agentic coding loops, aka normal Americans. There have been a number of utility related scandals, with residential power bills doubling as data centers go in and water being illegally take…

> Long term, the goal for this buildout is to drive millions of people out of their livelihood.

Remember HN -- this applies to most of you, too

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#124

Post by red-iron-pine »

inigyou wrote: post #102
Legend2440 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Not all consumption is good. That's not your call to make. If I am willing to spend my hard-earned money on a thing, it's because I think it will improve my life. Who are you to tell me otherwise? You're not my mom. And it is not true that we "Privatize the profits, socialize the losses". Bailouts are rare exceptions; in general, investors take the loss when a business fails. They are last in line in bankruptcy cour…

And there we have it. Corporations must have unlimited rights because, and I quote, "You're not my mom."

still a better argument than most of ayn rand

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#125

Post by inigyou »

bofadeez wrote: post #115
inigyou wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All your comments are just China China China China China. AI as envisioned by billionaires is pretty stupid. I think we'd be better off if we tricked China into building it.

[flagged]

I see the China China China China China account is an alt of the Fable Fable Fable Fable Fable account.

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#126

Post by nvme0n1p1 »

inigyou wrote: post #99
nvme0n1p1 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a goofy comment. "I hate that my tax dollars were used to bomb Iran" "So you would support the bombing of countries that aren't Iran?"

It was actually "so you would support a billionaire bombing Iran with his own dollars?"

Yeah you are right, that makes way more sense.

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#127

Post by burnte »

kridsdale1 wrote: post #71
burnte wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Billionaries like Kevin O'Leary and his ilk are behind those rumors because they want to discredit the local resistance. There's one activist in Utah, Caroline Gleich, has been exceptionally outspoken against O'Leary and he's said she's part of Chinese led resistance. It's pure insanity.

Classic red scare. “Oh, you hate the military industrial complex? What are you, a Pinko?”

Yep. "oh, you disagree with me? Clearly you're a dangerous person I need to stop other people from listening to!"

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#128

Post by pibaker »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #15

The rumor is going around on X that foreign enemies of the US (especially China) are trying to influence Americans through social networks against building data centers.

Maybe it's my bubble, but most people around me who are against AI cite job loss and Replacement as their concerns.

And guess who has been boasting about replacing workers and making everyone unemployed by 2030? Certainly not china.

Maybe they say different things domestically but I don't even recall any Chinese AI personality going around preaching about the upcoming AI doomsday while also building the doomsday device themselves, either.

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#129

Post by b40d-48b2-979e »

rzerowan wrote: post #16
b40d-48b2-979e wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

whether they actually just hate gas turbine generators running 24/7 in their neighborhoods. Or the increased pollution (air, light, and sound) from having a warehouse-sized building of GPUs next to you. I'm already annoyed by my neighbors having spotlights pointed at their own houses or leaving garage lights on through the night that shine in through my bedroom windows.

Im wondering why the typical design is a warehouse with horizontal sprawl . Wouldnt it make sense to go vertical up or down . Smaller footprint if insidea a metro area by having a skyscarper type data center , as i recall AT&T used to have such windowless anonymous buldings scattered in some cities for their equipment. Or have a Silo type structure going down if in a more rural area to not blight the landscape.With a…

    as i recall AT&T used to have such windowless anonymous buldings scattered in some cities
    for their equipment
I worked in Cleveland, and the AT&T building there was one such case. I heard their cabling went 3 stories underground on top of being around 50 floors tall.

Re: Americans are rallying against data centers. Surprisingly few are getting built

#130

Post by inigyou »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #117
inigyou wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why wouldn't we lament losing it? If all else was solved, a DC is just as valid industry as any other. The fact that the provided service is nonphysical doesn't matter - every industry is different. Should probably pay taxes though, and not terrorize the neighbors.

The reasons to care about "industry" in particular are process knowledge and highly skilled labor and supply chains. Datacenters have very little involvement in any of those. And they don't bring many jobs.

So basically your opinion is that data centers should not be illegal. Great! Let's start by dismantling the one serving your internet connection.
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