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How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

news.gallup.com

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Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#31

Post by VulgarExigency »

dzonga wrote: post #21

some of these media outlets manipulate public opinion. majority of the public can't differentiate between commerce & capitalism. nor socialism vs 'free markets'. the non-gullible people know it's not just about this vs that - but ultimately who controls what. ideally you want a system where no individual player or a few players can tip the system. the Chinese system is probably the closest to that - but then the CCP…

> the Chinese system is probably the closest to that - but then the CCP exists :( . a large player that can tip the scales. but for the rest of the businesses - it's dog eat dog - the better ones that survive are suited to serve the population while aligned to the goals of the population for a good part.

The reason the Chinese system works the way it does is precisely because the CPC exists.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#32

Post by mytailorisrich »

tw04 wrote: post #27
mytailorisrich wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People really need to give up the cold war, the failures of "end of history" thinking are directly related to all of the economic problems we have today. That's irrelevant to the point. The 1980s did settle the capitalism vs. socialism debate. The USSR and, perhaps more consequentially, China effectively abandonned socialism because it failed and acknowledged that capitalism, free enterprise, and the free market wa…

China doubled down, what on earth are you talking about? Every major corporation in China has a party member in a position of power to direct what the company does. And many of them have state ownership. https://sccei.fsi.stanford.edu/china-briefs/reassessing-role... https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/abs/arc-of-the-chinese-...

State ownership of many companies is not the same as socialism.

China has state capitalism and private capitalist enterprises, and free enterprise with robust free markets overall. These are the main reforms that allowed it to thrive after the catastrophe of socialism under Mao. Even basic stuff like farmers being allowed to sell surplus freely for profit and at market prices only became allowed in 1978.

China now has the second largest number of millionaires in USD after the US.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#34

Post by lapcat »

> 81% viewing free enterprise positively, compared with 54% for capitalism and 39% for socialism

> capitalism is much more likely than free enterprise to be associated with unequal distribution of wealth.

This is why the terms "capitalism" and "socialism" are largely useless in political debates, and people are mostly talking past each other.

When you look specifically at what Americans like about socialism, it's health care, education, welfare, and equality. I don't think many people want central planning of the entire economy, which is why critics of socialism raising the bogeyman of the USSR are missing the point.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#35

Post by dist-epoch »

thelastgallon wrote: post #8

Socialism is only for the super-duper rich, the 0.001%. Too big to fail, trickle down economics and all that. Capitalism for the poor, you gotta pull yourself up by the bootstraps. If you ain't successful, you aren't working hard enough.

Too Big To Jail, official US attorney general position, never forget:

> Attorney General Eric Holder on Wednesday sought to walk back comments that some financial institutions may be too large to prosecute, telling lawmakers at a lively Capitol Hill hearing that no single bank is above the law.

> In a March appearance before the Senate Judiciary Committee, Holder testified that big banks’ clout “has an inhibiting impact” on prosecutions. As he explained: I am concerned that the size of some of these institutions becomes so large that it does become difficult to prosecute them

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/eric-holder-backt...

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#36

Post by ourmandave »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #16
Avicebron wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People really need to give up the cold war, the failures of "end of history" thinking are directly related to all of the economic problems we have today. We could do - have done - much worse than implementing some good sense social safety net measures. Especially as people advocate for AI and using it to replace/disempower employees.

> People really need to give up the cold war, the failures of "end of history" thinking are directly related to all of the economic problems we have today. That's irrelevant to the point. The 1980s did settle the capitalism vs. socialism debate. The USSR and, perhaps more consequentially, China effectively abandonned socialism because it failed and acknowledged that capitalism, free enterprise, and the free market wa…

socialism = "social safety net measures", which it isn't but, as mentioned, it seems that many in the US think it is...

They think "Social Democracy", not pure "Socialism".

But the Right will equate one with the other to pretend the left are communists.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#37

Post by sph »

krapp wrote: post #18
Telaneo wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if does a whole lot of stuff, then it's communism.

If it does stuff for poor people it's communism. If it does stuff for rich people it's capitalism.

If it does stuff for the party officials, it’s communism.

No one has done anything for poor people since Jesus of Nazareth, probably.

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#38

Post by bee_rider »

pizzaiolo wrote: post #2

The caveat for anyone outside of the United States is that what they call "socialism" is really just capitalism with a welfare state.

That’s what some politicians here mean when they say it. The poll seems to indicate pretty negative results for “socialism,” which seems less likely if people were just interpreting it as capitalism+safetynet, right?

Re: How Americans view capitalism, socialism and free enterprise

#39

Post by thefz »

The US would be the biggest recipient of socialism right now yet they come from 50 years of propaganda against it; it's so ingrained in their minds that even someone in the most exploited working class would dismiss the idea as "communists want to steal your money1!1!1".
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