Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage • Hacker News Board

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#101

Post by QuantumNoodle » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:40 PM UTC

hectdev wrote: post #76

QuantumNoodle wrote: post #4

A hobby is something you enjoy the process of doing, not just the end result. Everybody likes a clean home, but cleaning is rarely a hobby. LLMs expedite achieving the end result. Take from that what you will.

I enjoy molding hyper specific software across my whole eco system of tech through prose with LLMs. Iterating over time to hone the right solutions based on very abstract reactions to the results I get. I would consider this a hobby because it costs me money and I get no value out of it outside of the act. I also woodwork and I remember this discussion there between hand tools, power tools, and CNCs. It's all the sam…

> I would consider this a hobby because it costs me money and I get no value out of it outside of the act.

I LOLd very hard at that one, thanks. Very relatable.

A hobby of mine is also woodworking. I can make jigs, I can buy jigs. I can use hand tools, I can use power tools. I can use screws I can use joints. I can even buy made furniture and just assemble it. Though the latter is more of interior designing. But the point is it is a spectrum and everyone has their own niche. SDLC are not the same and there is different value to be derived. But the process of woodworking makes me handy. The experience allows me to elegantly and cost efficiently fix broken things. It enables me to do interesting things in interesting ways and there is more of a community around that. If I automated away all the woodworking and just bought the furniture... Well there isn't much of a community around that except flexing who has more cash. Idk, I'm trying to have empathy for both those who are for and against it.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#102

Post by fnoef » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:44 PM UTC

hgoel wrote: post #58

I was somewhat conflicted seeing the way the OSdev community responds to LLM usage. I understand the conflict: the point of doing OSdev is that you're learning the low level hardware details and directly commanding the machine from the lowest level accessible. LLM usage is at odds with this. But, on the other hand, the primary issue with OSdev on modern hardware is the complete lack of documentation for most hardware…

Isn’t that the point of a hobby? To enjoy the path and not the result? To learn something new.

I understand using LLMs as tools to help you with your hobby, but I think when “Claude spends hours debugging it” it probably is no longer a hobby, but an outsourced job.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#103

Post by smallerize » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:50 PM UTC

ncphillips wrote: post #63

Aurornis wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The debate is about whether or not the new code qualifies as derived . They can remove all of the literal code matches from the codebase, but if it was written by having an LLM study the original code and then write something similar, it's hard to argue it's not a derivative work.

Genuine question: if a human did this manually would it be considered derived?

Yeah, absolutely. The defense there is "clean room reimplementation ". If anything, the use of an LLM would be stronger than a human doing the copying. (Assuming American jurisdiction!)

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#104

Post by effed3 » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:53 PM UTC

to someone hobby programming using LLM seems like running a marathon using a bicycle, you cross the finish, but at the end is not the same as running only by your only forces.

Others look only at the results, so LLM are only a tool (actually without a clearly instruction manual i suspect).

But programming (and so many others works) is not only about making, but learning and developping skills. When an LLM is not available? i think differences will be evident.

And roughly speaking: to check the result of LLM you have to be more capable than the bot, otherwise, who is the boss? And to develop those skills, you have to do it yourself.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#105

Post by acedTrex » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:55 PM UTC

hgoel wrote: post #58

I was somewhat conflicted seeing the way the OSdev community responds to LLM usage. I understand the conflict: the point of doing OSdev is that you're learning the low level hardware details and directly commanding the machine from the lowest level accessible. LLM usage is at odds with this. But, on the other hand, the primary issue with OSdev on modern hardware is the complete lack of documentation for most hardware…

> targeted usage for tedium that has very little value overall

The entire point of the article was the hobby is ascribing value to that tedium that the LLM is removing.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#106

Post by wewewedxfgdf » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:59 PM UTC

Don't tell me how to do my hobby.

That's the core of it - hobbies are doing what makes you happy - if that's LLMs great, if not, great.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#107

Post by acedTrex » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 8:59 PM UTC

anonreeeeplor wrote: post #56

I don’t understand the world of people who have this degree of free time (time / energy) given how much everything costs just to be alive. Maybe they live in a different universe where programming for fun and first principals of “learning” matters. But for the other 99% of humans, costs have gone up 40% due to money printing and anything like this looks like a waste of time.

> I don’t understand the world of people who have this degree of free time

You dont understand that people have hobbies they enjoy doing? Because thats the entire point of the article.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#108

Post by rsoto2 » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 9:00 PM UTC

minimaxir wrote: post #74

zapataband1 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Your entire commenting history is about how much you dislike LLMs (with the high likelihood that you would not accept any evidence about agentic productivity), which does not lead to good discourse on Hacker News.

lol "my girlfriend doesn't go here but you wouldn't even believe me if i lied about it"

disliking LLMs is just an opinion. Refusing to engage with an argument and instead defaulting to downvotes when you can't supply a reasonable argument or proof is just ai/corporate-fanaticism and self-delusion enhanced by LLM-dependence.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#109

Post by orsorna » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 9:06 PM UTC

ryandvm wrote: post #41

QuantumNoodle wrote: post #4

A hobby is something you enjoy the process of doing, not just the end result. Everybody likes a clean home, but cleaning is rarely a hobby. LLMs expedite achieving the end result. Take from that what you will.

Yeah, in my experience, the people that got into software engineering because of the money are absolutely thrilled with how LLMs are changing the industry. They mostly just liked getting results and LLMs are great for that. The people like me that sort of just stumbled into this career as a result of spending the evenings of our youth trying to get the computer to do interesting things don't seem to have as much appr…

Really hate this characterization, although to be fair I love the ops/infra side of things more. I've used to set up so many parts of my homelab manually, but now I can just get it all done. I've spent countless hours maintaining a Rpi server at the infancy of my interest in computing. Truly a lot of it is maintenance and busywork tasks. I am having more fun than ever. Perhaps some people like those busywork sysadmin tasks and gain enjoyment of the homelab hobby just from that...honestly I can't say I really understand it.

Re: Born Against, or why hobby programming communities are against LLM usage

#110

Post by lelanthran » Wed, Aug 05, 2026, 9:07 PM UTC

ryandvm wrote: post #41

QuantumNoodle wrote: post #4

A hobby is something you enjoy the process of doing, not just the end result. Everybody likes a clean home, but cleaning is rarely a hobby. LLMs expedite achieving the end result. Take from that what you will.

Yeah, in my experience, the people that got into software engineering because of the money are absolutely thrilled with how LLMs are changing the industry. They mostly just liked getting results and LLMs are great for that. The people like me that sort of just stumbled into this career as a result of spending the evenings of our youth trying to get the computer to do interesting things don't seem to have as much appr…

> Yeah, in my experience, the people that got into software engineering because of the money are absolutely thrilled with how LLMs are changing the industry. They mostly just liked getting results and LLMs are great for that.

Those people are in for the biggest shock and largest disappointment: when a bright teenager can replicate, with an LLM, what they produced with an LLM the pay is going to fall off a cliff.

At least those who really are into development to the point of writing their own OS, Language, etc can still enjoy it as a hobby.