Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

No Data Centers in My Backyard

jasmi.news

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 176 posts

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#81

Post by skywhopper »

decimalenough wrote: post #12
zkmon wrote: post #8

People in UK opposed train tracks in steam engine days, saying that the train engine sound scares their horses and cattle. Ofcourse data centers are far worse. But it is amusing to see how humanity continues to oppose tech and the tech buldozes anyway, like a evil monster.

How are they "far worse"? Steam trains are noisy, polluting, require tons of coal, kill animals and people in their way, and crash fairly regularly (when built with 1800s technology). A data center is a big grey box that sits there humming quietly, and that's it. They do require power and lots of it, but unlikely steam engines they'll happily use solar, nuclear or anything else.

They tend to use coal and natural gas, instead, often in especially dirty forms. The fact that they can use solar doesn’t mean they do.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#82

Post by ModernMech »

ianm218 wrote: post #73
ModernMech wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A school and hospital would do that more than a data center tho. Look at Merced California, used to be a nowhere destination. They built a UC there and now it’s a place students, PhDs and MDs from around the world want to move to. If UC Merced were a data center it would attract no one, it would drain and pollute the lake, and Merced CA would still be a nowhere destination.

We’re talking about rural Wisconsin - there is no world where you need to make a trade off between having school and a data center. Put a school in one field and a data center in a field further away. It just seems like you should tax the data center and then build a school or whatever else you think would help the local economy.

A data center turns the whole town into an industrial zone because of the sound and water pollution. No one wants to live near one, especially not doctors and teachers with young families who can choose to live anywhere.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#83

Post by skywhopper »

mapontosevenths wrote: post #45
StilesCrisis wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Data centers are quite loud.

I worked in a data center for a decade. None of the neighbors even knew what it was. One actually stopped me to ask. It was very loud inside, but you couldn't hear it from outside unless the power failed and the generators came on.

Yes, the new ones often use dirty generators 24/7, and probably will for years. They are loud and toxic to the local community.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#84

Post by inigyou »

mapontosevenths wrote: post #80
inigyou wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The new AI ones are built below minimum standards as a cash grab and they somehow manage to be as loud as jet engines. I have no idea how they manage to achieve that, but I try to avoid denying reality. I agree that an ordinary non-AI data center is no worse than an office building without the people, but that isn't what's happening right now.

> somehow manage to be as loud as jet engines Thats what anti-AI activists say. A decibel meter is about $20. For some reason the people in those videos never have one.

I saw one news report featuring a reporter casually holding a decibel meter. 55dB at a distance of about a kilometer.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#85

Post by Tade0 »

comrade1234 wrote: post #11

I have a property in NW Wisconsin. It's incredibly poor there - it seems like most people working age are on disability - the new form of welfare. Money is earned mostly in summer and hunting seasons. It's pretty depressing. Lots of alcohol problems. I hired someone to clear some trees and make lumber out of them once and he showed up for the job three months later. At least he showed up though. Weirdest thing - he n…

> Weirdest thing - he never came back after the job to get paid.

I believe you've met a Mike Garage:

https://x.com/japan_nobunaga/status/2083940637921943803

They don't always accept payment.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#86

Post by Delphiza »

afavour wrote: post #4

Some of the reaction to data center build outs has become irrational but frankly I see it as a reflection of the arrogance of the billionaire tech elite. Voters were told: - AI is going to take your jobs - We need to build our data centers for this job stealing tool - We need to build so quickly that there’s no time to do accurate assessments of what this will do to water or power supplies Turns out people don’t like…

"AI automating jobs", which is the narrative from tech bros to raise funding translates into "AI is going to take your job", for the average Joe. If you are a graphic designer that is now struggling to find work, why would you want a data centre in your town (or anywhere)?

Rejection (or fear) of AI translating into rejection of the physical infrastructure that supports it is perfectly reasonable.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#87

Post by user43928 »

ungreased0675 wrote: post #79

A good portion of this movement is irrational and driven by viral media. Last week a coworker was talking about how unbearably loud data centers are. I asked them if our parking lot is loud. (There’s a decent sized server floor in our building and a bunch of cooling equipment in the parking lot.) They had never noticed the cooling system. On the other hand, my city gave the local data centers big tax breaks to come h…

Is it big tech's responsibility to somehow 'contribute beneficially'? Data center construction is not a welfare project.

As long as there is no corruption involved, I do not see what is wrong with big tech choosing a project site where the cost is minimal.

If there are many poor rural cities which compete for data center deals, this seems to me like an efficient free market.

If public opinion swings, will this not influence politicians, and force big tech to provide better benefits in these deals?

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#88

Post by pama »

dqv wrote: post #52
pama wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The new ones will be though. Look up the specs for the NVIDIA Vera Rubin: no fans; recycled liquid cooling.

Some new ones might be.

Agreed in principle for today’s new ones, though with all the buying frenzy it quickly becomes hard to procure anything but the latest hardware and the economics of older generation hardware makes little sense for new data center deployments.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#89

Post by ptero »

deadbunny wrote: post #37
decimalenough wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are they "far worse"? Steam trains are noisy, polluting, require tons of coal, kill animals and people in their way, and crash fairly regularly (when built with 1800s technology). A data center is a big grey box that sits there humming quietly, and that's it. They do require power and lots of it, but unlikely steam engines they'll happily use solar, nuclear or anything else.

96db is quiet? https://www.eesi.org/articles/view/communities-are-raising-n...

The linked article claims that sound can be heard "hundreds of feet from the data center". That is a very short range.

As much as I doubt that spreading of the data centers is a good thing, noise is not the weapon to wield. Unless we are talking the center of a quaint town. And possibly not even then.

Re: No Data Centers in My Backyard

#90

Post by mapontosevenths »

inigyou wrote: post #84
mapontosevenths wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> somehow manage to be as loud as jet engines Thats what anti-AI activists say. A decibel meter is about $20. For some reason the people in those videos never have one.

I saw one news report featuring a reporter casually holding a decibel meter. 55dB at a distance of about a kilometer.

55db is lower than the noise floor in the average office. They were probably just measuring the background noise of regular-ass being outside.

For perspective, the inside of your home is probably about 40. When I turn on my box fan it's about 55.

That said they can be loud when the generators are running. It's possible that when the grid can't keep up the volume goes up, but thats not meant to be a long term state.

Post reply on HN