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Waymo in Dallas

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Re: Waymo in Dallas

#571

Post by hvb2 »

bryan_w wrote: post #486
hvb2 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> meaning that we don't tolerate machine incidents the same way we tolerate human ones. Any company that builds self driving cars or operates them should show how reliable they think they are. Not by showing pr material or stats, that's all 'free'. Make yourself, as the company, legally liable. If you think it's good, put your name on it and own the risk. When that happens, I'll trust whoever says it's safe.

Why don't you think waymo is liable? Who else would be responsible for an accident in one of their cars?

It's more in general, with self/autonomous driving. In the waymo case the company owns the cars and all, which makes it more clear.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#572

Post by infecto »

Grombobulous wrote: post #427
eagleinparadise wrote: post #232

As someone who works in commercial real estate, involved in about $300M of housing development, some of it affordable, i will say without any doubt that driverless cars are a very effective affordable housing policy that is not being considered or discussed by anyone. Any public dollar that gets contributed to housing, basically adds a 50% cost factor and assume whatever it is used for will take 2-3x as long to deliv…

With respect to you as a person and your ideas presented, this is one of the most car-brained posts I've ever read. > it's way more efficient than building $100 billion in transit that will take 200 years to build. What is efficient about a $13 highway widening project in Houston or the $24 billion (inflation-adjusted) and 15 years it cost to bury a highway in Boston? (It's not even much of a new highway, it's just u…

If you have to say “with respect” don’t say it at all. You can share your ideas without calling names.

A bus would simply never work. Busses, trains and other modes of group transport or hard or near impossible to get right in a sprawling suburban metro. It would be amazing if it was possible but folks are going to work in so many directions (there is not a single workplace hub) and after work they may be going to an entirely different location for dinner. I think it would be incredibly hard to get that problem right and you would still be fighting an uphill battle that people don’t like to take the public bus.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#573

Post by bluGill »

skipkey wrote: post #408
m_a_g wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God, I love how Americans will do anything but build public transport

So the DFW metroplex is an example of why it's difficult to build decent public transportation - it has a population of about half that of Greater London, covering over 24k square kilometers. Very few people work in the downtown areas. Most people live in a suburb and work in a suburb. I lived in the area for many years. At one point, I lived in a house, basically at Belt Line and highway 75, and worked at an office…

Bad operations is not the fault of transit it is the fault of operations. Making transit serve the poor is a political choice and the result is it didn't serve you. However there is every reason to think good operations with a good budget could serve you well.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#574

Post by infecto »

toasty228 wrote: post #569
missedthecue wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the simple fact of the matter is the Waymo is a better public transport solution for Dallas than the bus. The bus doesn't work very well in endless cul-de-sac suburbia, and that's what the Dallas/Fort Worth area (and indeed most of America) is. Like, you have to understand that most of Dallas isn't even commuting into downtown Dallas every day to work. They are just commuting to other suburbs and then back to their s…

They made it work in hong kong with buses/minibuses... it can work everywhere, as long as you try it a tiny bit. But no let's send billions to private company to add more 2500+ kg of metal that displace a single 70kg meatbag, such a waste of resources and energy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_light_bus

Is it not simply a density problem? HK is a very different beast or any other major dense urban area. Dallas is a sprawling with an urban communities and office buildings.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#575

Post by jeltz »

soco wrote: post #520
missedthecue wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the simple fact of the matter is the Waymo is a better public transport solution for Dallas than the bus. The bus doesn't work very well in endless cul-de-sac suburbia, and that's what the Dallas/Fort Worth area (and indeed most of America) is. Like, you have to understand that most of Dallas isn't even commuting into downtown Dallas every day to work. They are just commuting to other suburbs and then back to their s…

"If I had asked the customers what they wanted, they would have asked for a faster horse." Henry Ford, about the resistance to a paradigm change.

So you are pro-bus? Because Waymo is the faster horse for someone in Dallas while a working public transit would be the paradigm shift.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#576

Post by bluGill »

hibikir wrote: post #370
m_a_g wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God, I love how Americans will do anything but build public transport

Public transit is at its most useful and effective connecting dense, walkable locations. That's why it's so great in the world's best cities. The problem is a metro like DFW doesn't have the density to have said good public transit. If anything, many American cities have more bus lines and light rail lines than they would if you asked an European transit authority to decide where to build. Density first, very good tr…

Density is important, but overrated. There is plenty of density in the suburbs to support transit, but nobody gives transit the money needed for good service and so they don't get it. The money needed for his transit would be less than cars cost everyone.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#577

Post by infecto »

yreg wrote: post #483
missedthecue wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the simple fact of the matter is the Waymo is a better public transport solution for Dallas than the bus. The bus doesn't work very well in endless cul-de-sac suburbia, and that's what the Dallas/Fort Worth area (and indeed most of America) is. Like, you have to understand that most of Dallas isn't even commuting into downtown Dallas every day to work. They are just commuting to other suburbs and then back to their s…

Why is a bus not fit for endless culdesac suburbia where people are commuting between the suburbs instead of to the downtown? I really don't get it. Pretty much everywhere outside of US buses work no matter the city layout. Just add some stops and run some buses.

Why would you think it works? Let’s say you have a community of 100 people in Dallas. That neighborhood is going to be commuting in all sorts of directions, sure you might be able to transport some groups going the same direction but there is a complete lack of central offices so how does the last mile work? Lots of transfers would be required and that’s a nonstarter

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#578

Post by bluGill »

master-lincoln wrote: post #538
fishfasell wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dallas needs public transit badly too. It's the least walkable city I've ever been too.

How do you get to and off stations if it's not walkable? Isn't walk-ability a requirement for successful public transport?

People will figure it out if there is good transit. Sidewalks are cheap, they will build them if there is a place to get to.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#579

Post by infecto »

hahla wrote: post #496
yreg wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is a bus not fit for endless culdesac suburbia where people are commuting between the suburbs instead of to the downtown? I really don't get it. Pretty much everywhere outside of US buses work no matter the city layout. Just add some stops and run some buses.

Your entire view point is framed incorrectly. The problem isn’t can a bus solve the problem, it’s the majority of people don’t want to endure the hassle of riding the bus.

I don’t know why you’re being downvoted. People don’t comprehend some areas of the world are simply different. If you could get a bus to pick up near my house and drop me off near work absolutely I would consider it but the reality is everyone in most US cities are going in many different directions. It’s not a problem a bus can even solve and like you said, folks don’t want to take a bus.

Re: Waymo in Dallas

#580

Post by irowe »

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #534
missedthecue wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the simple fact of the matter is the Waymo is a better public transport solution for Dallas than the bus. The bus doesn't work very well in endless cul-de-sac suburbia, and that's what the Dallas/Fort Worth area (and indeed most of America) is. Like, you have to understand that most of Dallas isn't even commuting into downtown Dallas every day to work. They are just commuting to other suburbs and then back to their s…

> (and indeed most of America) Cookie cutter developments where each street is a culdesac or horseshoe with it's own HOA is the only economically sane way to any serious volume of detached single or multi unit detached housing development thanks to federal environmental regulation. Who screeches bloody murder at even the mere hint of making some adjustments there? Why nearly the same people who complain about the cur…

Can you explain how environmental regulations induce that housing style? I struggle to see the connection
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