Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
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Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
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Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#2In a nutshell: It's fine to use LLMs to answer questions, analyze, distill, refine, check, suggest, review. But not to create.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#3> Harassment is not allowed. You may not harass people for using an LLM, regardless of whether or not their use is banned by the policy. You must follow the Code of Conduct at all times when interacting with the Rust project.
This policy I like.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#4In a nutshell: It's fine to use LLMs to answer questions, analyze, distill, refine, check, suggest, review. But not to create.
Hmm, that doesn't sound too bad. So you basically get to use a tool to help with the tedious parts, without being allowed to use the same tool to pass off said tedium to others.
This closes the gap. A key insight. A load bearing difference.
Now, is writing code considered tedium, for a project like Rust?
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#5In a nutshell: It's fine to use LLMs to answer questions, analyze, distill, refine, check, suggest, review. But not to create.
Yes, and I think the reasons set out in TFA are interesting, which on my reading are:
1) Code is the least interesting bit in some ways - they’re trying to build not only rust but a community of experts around rust which is able to maintain and improve it in the long term and the authors of prs need to understand the code deeply and show a willingness to be part of that long run. Llm-generated code even if it looks polished doesn’t indicate a human author who deeply understands it and is willing to be part of that long term maintenance.
2) They don’t have (and don’t want to enforce) a community consensus that llms are good or llms are bad. They just want some rules written down so everyone knows where they stand and people of either camp (and none) can get on with it.
Seems a pretty reasonable approach to me although I don’t really use rust much so don’t have a vested interest.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#6> Harassment is not allowed . You may not harass people for using an LLM, regardless of whether or not their use is banned by the policy. You must follow the Code of Conduct at all times when interacting with the Rust project. This policy I like.
You know rustaceans hate anything LLM when mods have to make this a rule.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#7In a nutshell: It's fine to use LLMs to answer questions, analyze, distill, refine, check, suggest, review. But not to create.
Sounds like the beginning of the end of rust to me
AI is a jet engine - Banning is for creation is like saying "we require you to go by ship/car/propeller-plane"
Yes, a policy that says AI slop PRs will not be tolerated. But I've had AI track down real hard to find bugs in several projects and provide correct fixes. I've also had AI build new features and new products. The project that ignores this acceleration will eventually fall behind the ones that embrace it.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#8In a nutshell: It's fine to use LLMs to answer questions, analyze, distill, refine, check, suggest, review. But not to create.
Yes, and I think the reasons set out in TFA are interesting, which on my reading are: 1) Code is the least interesting bit in some ways - they’re trying to build not only rust but a community of experts around rust which is able to maintain and improve it in the long term and the authors of prs need to understand the code deeply and show a willingness to be part of that long run. Llm-generated code even if it looks p…
No codebase worth being deeply invested in is deeply understood by anyone, including the original authors. The eternal maintenance argument is tiresome. If there is a problem in need of fixing, you figure it out, you do not depend on some author being available, and LLMs are exceptionally helpful in this regard as well. Then, if the LLM has trouble figuring out, so will another human. It is a code smell.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#9> Harassment is not allowed . You may not harass people for using an LLM, regardless of whether or not their use is banned by the policy. You must follow the Code of Conduct at all times when interacting with the Rust project. This policy I like.
You know rustaceans hate anything LLM when mods have to make this a rule.
It's not "rustaceans" as one whole. It's a very vocal minority (both rustacean and not) that make it everyone else's problem that they don't agree with the AI industry as a whole. I've had people try to convince me that I'm destroying the planet by using LLMs just because the process of creating the LLM was harmful to the climate. But that's like saying software piracy harms sales. Maybe the argument has more merit for models hosted in the cloud, but I use local ones too.
There's a shameboard that curates a list of projects that don't explicitly and unconditionally ban all use of generative AI. Their term for projects that have a policy other than a total ban is "permissive" and it is treated as a sign to avoid that project/community. It's such a mess. Cancel culture is never the answer. I believe it is the right move to ban this completely unproductive and toxic kind of behavior.
Re: Rust-lang/rust is adopting an LLM policy
#10In a nutshell: It's fine to use LLMs to answer questions, analyze, distill, refine, check, suggest, review. But not to create.
Sounds like the beginning of the end of rust to me AI is a jet engine - Banning is for creation is like saying "we require you to go by ship/car/propeller-plane" Yes, a policy that says AI slop PRs will not be tolerated. But I've had AI track down real hard to find bugs in several projects and provide correct fixes. I've also had AI build new features and new products. The project that ignores this acceleration will…
"AI is a jet engine "
and rust just wants to ensure you are a capable pilot that can actually steer a plane before stealing everyone else's attention