I love you, dad • Hacker News Board

Re: I love you, dad

#51

Post by jacoblyles » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:05 PM UTC

king_jester wrote: post #27

speeder wrote: post #7

I am very happy that my parents are married to each other, and my alive grandparents too, and that they don't have issues like this (what my father "abuse" is coca-cola, he rarely drinks, and noone smokes). And I am very sad to see that all other families are crumbling. I am seeking a girlfriend that wants to be a mother, and I am not finding, most of them are self-centered, and come from divorced families, the only…

If you want to have kids and want a partner that is into that, that's fine. However, being self-centered and wanting to be a parent aren't mutually exclusive, as I have met adults whose parents were/are extremely self-centered and that factored in heavily into the abusive situations those adults lived in when they were children. > And I am very sad to see that all other families are crumbling. I'm not really sure wha…

Actually, the crumbling of the family is quite new. The past 50 years has seen a rapid and sad dissolution of the family: http://dalrock.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/p70-126_pdf_hist_...

Re: I love you, dad

#52

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:06 PM UTC

akie wrote: post #16

speeder wrote: post #7

I am very happy that my parents are married to each other, and my alive grandparents too, and that they don't have issues like this (what my father "abuse" is coca-cola, he rarely drinks, and noone smokes). And I am very sad to see that all other families are crumbling. I am seeking a girlfriend that wants to be a mother, and I am not finding, most of them are self-centered, and come from divorced families, the only…

You must be quite young. To me, what defines a good relationship (in terms of having a partner) is not necessarily that what you have in common with the other is a strong desire for stability, family life & kids. I've seen people get married because of this desire, and the people I've observed doing that don't necessarily seem very happy. On the contrary, actually. After a while they just become jaded. Like people in…

[deleted]

Re: I love you, dad

#53

Post by jacoblyles » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:08 PM UTC

pekk wrote: post #32

speeder wrote: post #7

I am very happy that my parents are married to each other, and my alive grandparents too, and that they don't have issues like this (what my father "abuse" is coca-cola, he rarely drinks, and noone smokes). And I am very sad to see that all other families are crumbling. I am seeking a girlfriend that wants to be a mother, and I am not finding, most of them are self-centered, and come from divorced families, the only…

Many women want to be mothers. Having a kid is easier than falling off a log, it just takes time. However, it's not correct to imply that women with divorced families are worse somehow.

I would be interested in knowing whether or not one's likelihood to divorce is correlated with whether or not one's parents were divorced. Do you know what the data say?

edit: I found some data. It looks like a couple is twice as likely to divorce if one of them comes from a divorced family, and three times as likely if both do: http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/26714.php

Re: I love you, dad

#54

Post by kristofferR » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:11 PM UTC

alexakarpov wrote: post #35

illuminate wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Unless you believe in God" If only the belief in God sincerely caused a difference in substance abuse, I'd be endorsing religiosity for its own sake! Of course, I'm sure you're referencing the will of God, but considering how many sincere faithful have their struggles with physical addiction, the belief alone is not enough :(

There are some indicators that it does make a difference; too lazy to dig those up, but it should not be surprising that adhering to some religious doctrine that discourages activity X should have some effect on reducing the frequency of X abuse among the adherents (not just the reported numbers, but actual values too). However, what I wanted to say is more like - if you don't have a crane, yet need to lift an X-wing…

On the other hand - when you strongly discourage something and decide to make doing it wrong/immoral, you also make it very taboo and stigmatized to talk about, which can be incredibly dangerous.

This is very obvious with illegal drug use and sex, problems related to them (drug addiction and unwanted pregnancies/STDs) are much higher in places where it is strongly discouraged, stigmatized and hard to talk about.

There are a lot of sad stories where people who knew they had a drug problem didn't dare seeking help/talking about it in fear of either the law or negative reactions from the people around them.

Wrong/lack of information about safety is also a huge issue due to making stuff immoral and taboo, millions of people in Africa have died and are currently suffering because of the way extramarital sex and condom use have been (and still are) handled and talked about.

Personally I think complete openness instead of moralization/stigmatization is a much better solution to deal with difficult issues. Granted, I'm a very socially liberal guy, but I think most evidence is pointing to the fact that information and sympathy is leading to more desirable social outcomes than repression and stigmatization.

For example, let's take something extremely controversial as pedophilia. The vast majority of society is of the understandable opinion that being a pedophile is immoral, often downright evil. People unfortunately don't realize how extremely important the different between simply being a pedophile (having sexual thoughts about children) and actually committing such acts are.

I think even something as pedophilia should be freely discussed and that pedophiles should be offered rational stigma-free ways to deal with their sexuality in ways that won't hurt children instead of being treated like scum by society. The way we deal with the issue today is hurting everyone involved - both the pedophiles and children.

A ton of people undoubtedly disagrees with me - and that's understandable from an emotion point of view. However - I've never seen any research or statistics actually indicating that punishing people for their problems (either directly through the law or through stigma) leads more significant positive societal outcomes than helping and sympathizing people with their problems does.

Re: I love you, dad

#55

Post by steferson » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:13 PM UTC

My uncle hanged himself after years being an alcoholic, the alcohol destroyed his family and pushed him away from everybody. Near the end of it all he was acting delusional, lying to his bar friends about how good his life was, just stright up making stuff up, like having a huge barbecue in his non existant farm, or so I heard through my dad. He killed himself between christmas and new year. His son spent christmas in my house, and I had the idea to go visit him, and days later he killed himself. For the longest time I blamed myself, I kept thoughts like "maybe if I had gone...", I kept believing that maybe the wanting to go see him was God's way to stop the tragedy from happening. I no longer blame myself, though I do wonder if having gone there would have changed anything.

Anyway, powerful blog post

Re: I love you, dad

#56

Post by swah » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:14 PM UTC

jbail wrote: post #6

That gave me chills. I'm constantly impressed by people that have the ability to share their personal life with the world in an honest way that reveals the vulnerabilities we all share as humans. It is so much more refreshing than the opposite, where we pretend our lives are perfect and we never experience moments of doubt or melancholy. It is rare to see someone make a post like this. This is precisely what makes it…

He's a good writer.

Re: I love you, dad

#57

Post by ColinWright » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:15 PM UTC

pekk wrote: post #32

speeder wrote: post #7

I am very happy that my parents are married to each other, and my alive grandparents too, and that they don't have issues like this (what my father "abuse" is coca-cola, he rarely drinks, and noone smokes). And I am very sad to see that all other families are crumbling. I am seeking a girlfriend that wants to be a mother, and I am not finding, most of them are self-centered, and come from divorced families, the only…

Many women want to be mothers. Having a kid is easier than falling off a log, it just takes time. However, it's not correct to imply that women with divorced families are worse somehow.

    > Having a kid is easier than falling off a log,
    > it just takes time.

Wrong, and to say so like that demonstrates both ignorance and a significant lack of sensitivity.

Re: I love you, dad

#58

Post by recycleme » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:17 PM UTC

A lot of readers will probably have some self-reflection after reading this. It might even push some to give their parents a call, or sort out some issues. Even someone with a perfect family will remember that nothing lasts forever. Enjoy your time friends.

Re: I love you, dad

#59

Post by jacoblyles » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:21 PM UTC

kristofferR wrote: post #54

alexakarpov wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some indicators that it does make a difference; too lazy to dig those up, but it should not be surprising that adhering to some religious doctrine that discourages activity X should have some effect on reducing the frequency of X abuse among the adherents (not just the reported numbers, but actual values too). However, what I wanted to say is more like - if you don't have a crane, yet need to lift an X-wing…

On the other hand - when you strongly discourage something and decide to make doing it wrong/immoral, you also make it very taboo and stigmatized to talk about, which can be incredibly dangerous. This is very obvious with illegal drug use and sex, problems related to them (drug addiction and unwanted pregnancies/STDs) are much higher in places where it is strongly discouraged, stigmatized and hard to talk about. Ther…

Alcoholics Anonymous famously has "turning your life over to a higher power" as one of their 12 steps. They also provide a very open community. They seem to have some success.

Re: I love you, dad

#60

Post by microtonal » Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 7:24 PM UTC

dos1 wrote: post #17

redad wrote: post #2

My father has substance abuse problems too (alcohol dependency for 20 years) and it has destroyed his relationship with my siblings and my mother, he's going to lose what little he has left very soon and I genuinely fear he's going to do something very similar to what is mentioned here. I am the only child that will talk to him without contempt and I have long since left home. He lost his own father very recently and…

Disclaimer: This is my own personal experience and opinion. I've dealt with substance abuse issues for many years and I've known several people for whom substance abuse exacted the ultimate toll. The short of it: There are no reliable solutions. There are no good answers. People with depression and substance abuse issues don't think the way non abusers do. They know what they're doing is wrong and that it could lead…

People with depression and substance abuse issues don't think the way non abusers do. They know what they're doing is wrong and that it could lead to death or going further down the spiral, but their ability to rationalize their behavior is all powerful. It has nothing to do with will power or motivation. There's something wired differently in the brain.

This. What helped me is to see the good person behind the illness and separate that him or her from the illness. During bad moment, it will affect you less (it's the illness, not that soul that is affected by it), during good moments it is easier to connect to that person.

Also, if someone has a severe mental illness that cannot be cured or properly medicated, and has young children, protect them if it is within your power. Every child has the right (and need) to grow up in a safe environment.