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Nobel Disease

en.wikipedia.org

61–70 of 139 posts

Re: Nobel Disease

#61
post #32
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It is ethically unsound.

"Ethics" is subjective, there is no such thing as an objective ethics (unless you are religious).

This is why thought experiments like the Trolley problems don't have a simple answer.. and they get even more complex with variations of the thought experiment.

Re: Nobel Disease

#62
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lab leak is one thing, "deliberately created and escaped" is a different story.

"deliberately (created and escaped)" is very implausible yes. "(deliberately created) and escaped" not so much though.

Agreed, and I think conflating these two is one of the reasons for the resistance towards the lab leak theory that gp mentioned.

Re: Nobel Disease

#63
post #40
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is ethically unsound.

are ethics man-made or „given“ to us by god, the watchmaker or the universe?

Eugenics rejects the idea that all are created equal. Equality is supported by both Judeo-Christian theology and secular enlightenment philosophy.

I can think of little modern philosophy more regressive than the idea that a self-appointed superior can determine that another is inferior to the point that they (or their offspring) should be culled from existence. Eugenics and racism have been intertwined since the beginning and with a modern twist continue to target vulnerable populations.

Re: Nobel Disease

#64
post #60

This has always felt like such a weird quirk in human behavior. Imagine a 5 year old who is good at basketball. His parents notice it and enroll him in a class. Coaches recognize his talent and dedicate special time to him. He trains every morning, every night and entire weekends through primary, middle and high school. Gets barely any time for classes, but he anyways just needs a passing grade (which teachers are ha…

> will undoubtedly influence the opinions of millions.

Is this actually true, based on just one statement?

Usually the ones who change their minds so easily, are following a person like a cult almost, and go with whatever they say, whenever they say.

There aren't huge masses of millions of people idly watching TV, coming across an interview with some random baseball star and trusts his opinion on stuff.

Personally, I think in generally the problem is "celebrity worship", and all the related things, rather than just about the specific person who said something, or even about the platform. People are so quick to just go "Well, I like that person, so whatever they say, is what I think more or less" which is absolutely bananas to me.

Re: Nobel Disease

#65

> an informal term for the embrace of strange or scientifically unsound ideas by some Nobel Prize winners, usually later in life. It has been argued that the effect results, in part, from a tendency for Nobel winners to feel empowered by the award to speak on topics outside their specific area of expertise Sounds pretty much like every founder out there who strike gold once in the past now believing their genius now…

A lot of that comes from becoming incredibly rich then adopting morals and policy preferences that align with that level of wealth inequality

Re: Nobel Disease

#66

I'm surprised the article doesn't address the Occam's Razor probability that... _most people_ hold ideas that the (a?) majority does not... and that increased media attention is likely to "discover" these beliefs. Or rather, I see no attempt to make an argument that Nobel laureates are statistically _more_ likely than other "well-known" non-politicians to hold non-majoritarian ideas... nor any attempt to argue that t…

My thought too - lots of people have cranky ideas. But they only get taken seriously if they get a Nobel or something like that.

Re: Nobel Disease

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key point is it’s not just ethically wrong, but it’s not scientific because it’s subjective and has no basis in reality. For instance, you cannot use genetic studies to define a race because for instance, in Africa, you could have massive genetic diversity in people that are 200 miles apart. That doesn’t make them different races. If you did attempt to classify people into races based on something scientific like…

> If you did attempt to classify people into races based on something scientific like genetics, you would end up with hundreds of thousands of “races”. With even more fine tooth classification, you could subdivide those people into further sub groups that becomes indistinguishable from just classifying extended families. 'Biologically speaking', wouldn't that 'just' be something like breeds? * https://en.wikipedia.or…

Yeah, but at the end of the day, all of this classification is very arbitrary. Until you can come up with a measurable system like “8% genetic differences are defined as a different species” or “can successfully interbreed with viable non-sterile offspring” or something it’s all just a useful pneumonic to understand the world, but it’s not really objective science. Dog breeds are notoriously subjective and just depends on what the registry in the place wanted to do.

Re: Nobel Disease

#68

> In his autobiography, Mullis professed a belief in astrology and wrote about an encounter with a fluorescent, talking raccoon that he suggested might have been an extraterrestrial alien. Absolutely wild shit whoa

You don’t need a Nobel prize to see talking raccoon aliens. Just take a heroic dose of hallucinogens.

Re: Nobel Disease

#69

A lot of these aren't "strange or scientifically unsound ideas" but downright racism. Whether Nobel prize recipients are less or more racist than their contemporaries is debatable but I'm not sure they fit the same category as "believed in ghosts" or "claims to have talked to a fluorescent racoon".

The key point is it’s not just ethically wrong, but it’s not scientific because it’s subjective and has no basis in reality. For instance, you cannot use genetic studies to define a race because for instance, in Africa, you could have massive genetic diversity in people that are 200 miles apart. That doesn’t make them different races. If you did attempt to classify people into races based on something scientific like…

That just means you can't call Africans one "race" because they hold all the genetic diversity on the planet. But it doesn't mean there's not some meaningful genetic grouping of populations that splintered out of Africa. Or, concretely, I'm struggling to square what you're saying with the fact that I tell my doctor I'm Hispanic because that means a higher genetic predisposition to things like diabetes.

Re: Nobel Disease

#70

The first entries are a bit weird to me. They are mostly about eugenics for people who got their Nobel prices in the early 1900s. The thing is that in those days even the state of California promoted eugenics [1]. And according to Wikipedia, so much so that they might have even played a role in influencing Germany [2]. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_California [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_e…

You've touched on the whole problem with the "cancel culture" of today.

Scientific and political beliefs often do not stand the test of time, but is it fair to blame the people of past eras for their misjudgements using the values of today?

How do we know for sure when we're right about something?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8V8rtdXnLA

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