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German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

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Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#31

Post by lysace »

sajithdilshan wrote: post #25
leonidasrup wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

German car industry can produce state of art ICE, because they can manufacture the heart of ICE - the engine. German car industry is trailing with EVs, because they can not manufacture the heart of EV - the battery.

I think the biggest problem with German EVs are not the battery but the software. EVs are practically computers on a wheel and compared to the competitors the software and features it offers are still terrible. I remember VW even had a huge joint venture with Rivian to get things back on track. But seems like it didn’t work out

Is the Chinese automotive software better than the German equivalent?

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#32

Post by sajithdilshan »

calvinmorrison wrote: post #26
warkdarrior wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what is the right amount of management, and I'm sure there are some management roles that add no value, but it seems to me that you cannot have UPS function with just a CEO and, say, 10000 delivery drivers and no middle managers.

its just people underestimating what people do in their actual jobs. Every thing has a huge long tail of work. things like 'accounting' is obvious but there are entire jobs around just buying stuff, around logistics, around fleet management, around managing your staff (HR), there are LOTs of specialized roles and they're not all dumb because you think they don't do anything. Even in accounting there are many roles an…

I think you misunderstood my comment, I was talking about different layers of management. Not different roles like accounting or sales etc. but there is absolutely no reason to have 10 different layers of management.

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#33

Post by ahartmetz »

sajithdilshan wrote: post #20
tcfhgj wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't have kind words for SPD/Die Grünen in specific, or, to be frank, Germany in general. because they've governed Germany for the past decades ... wait ... they have not?

SPD has been part of almost every government formed since the WWII

Oh no, not at all. When CDU and SPD were both very strong (until about 2005-2010), they never once had a coalition, and CDU won elections more often than SPD.

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#34

Post by dgellow »

rwmj wrote: post #10

Not a scientific study, but here in the UK where we don't have tariffs against Chinese car manufacturers, there are loads of electric BYDs and Jaecoos (the "Temu Range Rover") driving around recently.

The BYD cars are in Germany too, I see them quite often in cities

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#35

Post by Barrin92 »

leonidasrup wrote: post #22
est31 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah with China pumping state subventions into car manufacturing, they can outcompete any car manufacturer anywhere in the world. The leading battery technology is in Asia anyways. The German car industry will not die completely, as the EU can protect its market from chinese manufacturers through regulation. But it will shrink and transform. Probably also back to fossil fuels (yuck), because there the Germans still h…

German car industry can produce state of art ICE, because they can manufacture the heart of ICE - the engine. German car industry is trailing with EVs, because they can not manufacture the heart of EV - the battery.

that's not the issue, you can buy the batteries if you wanted to. The problem is that EVs require about 50% less labor than ICE cars and this is the first time since the 80s that German car companies have started to fire anyone or close plants. Car companies here aren't price competitive, software or a battery you can always purchase.

China has the big advantage of having designed these car companies around drastically reduced labor needs and until we adapt to that we're not going to compete on the most important factor which is how much the car costs.

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#36

Post by ahartmetz »

sajithdilshan wrote: post #27
est31 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah with China pumping state subventions into car manufacturing, they can outcompete any car manufacturer anywhere in the world. The leading battery technology is in Asia anyways. The German car industry will not die completely, as the EU can protect its market from chinese manufacturers through regulation. But it will shrink and transform. Probably also back to fossil fuels (yuck), because there the Germans still h…

Last time the Germans got into defence technology, it didn’t end well for the whole world. Let’s hope it wouldn’t be the case this time

Well, the intention is much more really-actually-defensive this time.

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#37

Post by chewz »

nxm wrote: post #28
emsign wrote: post #11

At least I hope they leave the corporate culture baggage that has ruined the German car industry behind and do not transplant it into other companies. In which you stick to your old guns and hope that politics protects you with tariffs against any future developments from international competitors on the car market. (It failed. Now the Chinese make better cars than the Germans.)

[flagged]

If by heavy subsidies you mean - encouraging internal competition, securing cheap energy and educating thousands of engineers then yes, Chinese cars are subsidized.

If by heavy subsidies you mean pocketing 150 billions of dollars from EU R&D budget for innovation that have never happened then no, Chinese cars manufacturers are not subsidized.

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#38

Post by seanalltogether »

rwmj wrote: post #10

Not a scientific study, but here in the UK where we don't have tariffs against Chinese car manufacturers, there are loads of electric BYDs and Jaecoos (the "Temu Range Rover") driving around recently.

Yeah I can get a byd dolphin for half the price of the cheapest tesla. I'm sure the 2 aren't equally comparable, but considering all we need is a second car for my wife to drive at most 20-30 miles per day, I could never justify a tesla for that.

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#39

Post by sajithdilshan »

ahartmetz wrote: post #33
sajithdilshan wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SPD has been part of almost every government formed since the WWII

Oh no, not at all. When CDU and SPD were both very strong (until about 2005-2010), they never once had a coalition, and CDU won elections more often than SPD.

Yeah right, Willy Brandt and Helmut Schmidt are from CDU

Re: German carmakers flood jobs market with managers after wielding axe

#40

Post by nradov »

These corporate fads always run in cycles. Any large organization needs some resource managers but what is the optimal span of control? What tends to happen is that businesses lay off a bunch of managers and flatten the hierarchy. This does increase efficiency for a while. But then it becomes harder to keep individual contributors on track and focused towards key goals so the executives eventually end up hiring more managers again.
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