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Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

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Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#101

Post by etdznots »

Aurornis wrote: post #51
bitwize wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple TV has a search function that allows you to find a film or series irrespectice of whatever service it's on, and launch the appropriate app to play it.

Some times I read these mental gymnastics comments about piracy being easier and wonder if these people have actually tried to learn how to use something like an Apple TV. I think the services part they really dislike is just the part where your credit card gets charged when you click the buy or rent button. Doing all of the piracy stuff with VPNs and navigating torrent sites and getting a setup where you can play fi…

you bought a smart tv maybe you got a dumb tv and then plugged in a dongle? Or maybe you bought a smart tv and also purchased another home media device thingy and you gotta remember to switch to w the apple tv for this thingy. you signed in to it you created dozens ? Hundreds? Of accounts to watch all the content you want, try to figure out what plan you need to watch the content? Will you subscribe for a bit and cancel later ah ok siri set a reminder to cancel the subscriotion ill take care of that. Wait oops i went on vacation and netflix is mad that im. Not watching from home do i need a different plan? How do these amazon prime video channel subscriptions work how many do i have?

All that instead of a jellyfin server and a single search? It’s all gymnastics just different gymnastics

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#102

Post by js8 »

__MatrixMan__ wrote: post #70
bonoboTP wrote: post #67

This is AI written. Next time just paste your prompt or conversation with the AI that wrote the article. I'll then converse with Claude about it myself. There is no need for this intermediary.

I think you're joking, but there are some topics where what you're describing might be a great way to communicate an idea. > I believe {audacious claim}. I've prepared this chatbot to defend the claim. If don't already agree, tell the bot why I'm wrong and it'll convince you that I'm right. Because if you've anticipated and countered all likely objections, you still don't know, for any given reader, which of those ob…

I agree, I think having our own arguments reviewed by an AI first would be a great way to improve online discussions.

Also, people should use AI as a personal spam filter.

However, this should be done with local AI, not an intermediary service. And I think local AI will eventually win.

That also doesn't mean you should stop communicating normally in meatspace.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#103

Post by tr4656 »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #85
Aurornis wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Piracy is a service problem > Meanwhile the pirates offer Blu-Ray remuxes with commentary tracks, subtitles for every language, DRM free files that just work on your video player of choice. I think the only people who believe that pirating is easier than using the streaming services are people who spend so much time with computers that they round the mental overhead of navigating torrent websites, finding the corre…

> Nobody is ever going to convince me that pirating is actually easier than finding the thing I want to watch and putting it on my credit card. That's just because you're fine with consuming the low quality slop they stream out. Doesn't mean people who care more than you do are engaging in "mental gymnastics". We don't want the same things. I want the best version of everything. The highest quality version. The uncen…

That's true, but a lot of the time the best version is available on a blu ray you can buy.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#104

Post by laserlight »

tokioyoyo wrote: post #78
matheusmoreira wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Piracy is a service problem. Copyright monopolists always defeat themselves with their obnoxious greed. Things were easy enough when Netflix had a complete catalog, now every studio wants to roll their own shitty streaming services in order to cut Netflix out. Result is a fragmented mess where you want to watch a great film but you have no idea where the hell it even is, and even if you find it you discover it doesn'…

Every time this argument comes up, it doesn’t explain why piracy rates are much lower, despite having a lot of service problems. Piracy is a cultural thing. And I’m saying this as someone who kinda understands the pirate’s position.

> it doesn’t explain why piracy rates are much lower, despite having a lot of service problems.

Can you explain why you think piracy rates must be higher? Piracy isn't “free” after all.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#105

Post by alfiedotwtf »

aftbit wrote: post #11

The same argument applies to DRM and piracy. DRM only disadvantages people who want to consume content legally. Only one person has to bypass it (be it through cryptographic or software failings or the good old fashioned analog hole ala telesync) then upload the resulting unencumbered media file to a piracy site. As a result, it's not just cheaper, but also easier and more reliable to steal media than it is to buy it…

> As a result, it's not just cheaper, but also easier and more reliable to steal media than it is to buy it legally. > > What would happen if media were offered without DRM?

You kind of answered your own question. What you should have asked instead was - What would happen if media and payment was a straight forward offer we would have Netflix

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#106

Post by anon373839 »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #97

I don't understand what we're talking about here. The cryptography debate was won because the government was wrong. PGP for example is not dangerous, it's a safe and well-behaved piece of software that prevents certain messages from being read by people other than their intended recipient. If PGP had "escaped containment by finding a zero-day in a package proxy and reached production infrastructure at Hugging Face, e…

> PGP for example is not dangerous ... If PGP had "escaped containment"

I think the disconnect here is the dishonest framing that OpenAI have purposefully put on this incident. Their LLM did not "escape containment" in this "rogue AI" Hollywood blockbuster sense that they want you to believe. An LLM cannot do that; it is just a static computation graph that outputs a probability distribution.

What escaped "containment" is a piece of software they wrote that uses an LLM and which, through OpenAI's negligence, lacked ordinary technical and human guardrails that should have been present. It was run in "YOLO mode" with gobs of compute and no human oversight. That situation is the source of the danger, not the model weights. The model itself was simply given the opportunity to generate a bazillion commands, many of which were nonsensical garbage, and a few of which worked. It was not the work of a supreme intelligence.

This distinction is very important, because OpenAI have shifted the discourse from where it should be (OpenAI's negligent use of software) to a place that serves their strategic business interests.

LLMs remix existing knowledge and output text. That is not inherently hazardous. What can be hazardous is bolting systems that touch the real world onto them. But it's always possible to make a tool dangerous by misusing it.

For example, vehicles (which do have inherent dangers) are widely accepted as ordinary and useful tools. So are bricks. But if you strap a brick to the accelerator, you have made an autonomous murder machine that can escape containment! The existence of this possibility does not imply that we should rethink automobile licensing or the sale of bricks.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#107

Post by overfeed »

deyiao wrote: post #32

It's unfortunate that the final few years of the fastest AGI progress happen to coincide with a global surge in nationalism, polarization, and mutual hostility between human groups. That raises a disturbing failure mode: under intense conflict, an AI could learn that exterminating some groups of humans is a justified or even desirable objective. Once that principle is accepted, the step to concluding that exterminati…

> That raises a disturbing failure mode: under intense conflict, an AI could learn that exterminating some groups of humans is a justified or even desirable objective

That is not a failure mode; its the default. Whoever is developing an AI - let alone an AGI - will shape it to, or alternately only accept one that is aligned with their world-view. If it goes against their interests in any way, they'll pull the plug and start another round of training from the last acceptably-aligned checkpoint. US DoD A(G)Is will follow DoD doctrine, and the same goes for those by the PLA, anything less will not be fit for purpose.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#108

Post by nradov »

yndoendo wrote: post #44
matheusmoreira wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Piracy is a service problem. Copyright monopolists always defeat themselves with their obnoxious greed. Things were easy enough when Netflix had a complete catalog, now every studio wants to roll their own shitty streaming services in order to cut Netflix out. Result is a fragmented mess where you want to watch a great film but you have no idea where the hell it even is, and even if you find it you discover it doesn'…

Issues and topics that are reduced to a single idea are oversimplified to were lost of reality can take hold. Example, say person chooses to never fund Amazon. Amazon owns MGM. The only way that person can watch an MGM movie is through piracy. The only alternative would be to buy second hand content so MGM / Amazon do not get a finical cut. As media corporations become more monopolistic, like Paramount buying Warner…

So just watch something else. We have more video content available than anyone could possibly watch in a lifetime.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#109

Post by fc417fc802 »

tokioyoyo wrote: post #78
matheusmoreira wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Piracy is a service problem. Copyright monopolists always defeat themselves with their obnoxious greed. Things were easy enough when Netflix had a complete catalog, now every studio wants to roll their own shitty streaming services in order to cut Netflix out. Result is a fragmented mess where you want to watch a great film but you have no idea where the hell it even is, and even if you find it you discover it doesn'…

Every time this argument comes up, it doesn’t explain why piracy rates are much lower, despite having a lot of service problems. Piracy is a cultural thing. And I’m saying this as someone who kinda understands the pirate’s position.

Isn't the explanation self evident? Piracy requires nonzero technical competency (not much but still), dedicated computing hardware, and a decent chunk of storage. It's a fairly low barrier to entry but it is nonetheless a barrier and your typical person off the street these days doesn't reliably know what files and folders are.

Re: Twenty-five years ago it was cryptography, today it's model weights

#110

Post by nradov »

Aurornis wrote: post #51
bitwize wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple TV has a search function that allows you to find a film or series irrespectice of whatever service it's on, and launch the appropriate app to play it.

Some times I read these mental gymnastics comments about piracy being easier and wonder if these people have actually tried to learn how to use something like an Apple TV. I think the services part they really dislike is just the part where your credit card gets charged when you click the buy or rent button. Doing all of the piracy stuff with VPNs and navigating torrent sites and getting a setup where you can play fi…

I would be happy to pay to buy or rent a single show or movie. The problem is that a lot of that content is only available with a monthly subscription. Screw that, those monthly bills eat you alive. I hear that the For All Mankind series is pretty good but there's no way I'm signing up for Apple TV just to watch that. So I'll skip it and watch something else.
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