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Big Food vs. the People

lighthousereports.com

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Re: Big Food vs. the People

#81

Post by munk-a »

Cpoll wrote: post #58
shermantanktop wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are saying "an NGO probably has an agenda." Ok, sure, they are not robots with no opinions, and if you read even the first few sentences of that report you can see the opinion. But if you are suggesting that this NGO is carrying water for some unspecified shadowy group that is pulling the strings, you'll need to provide some backing for that. Who has a nefarious motivation to oppose junk food? Trial lawye…

> motivation to oppose junk food. On social media, making dubious claims about food science or food ingredients, then following up by selling some "clean, unprocessed, organic" product is big business. (I make no claims about this specific NGO).

Yes - the obvious state of dysfunction in food regulation and lack of enforcement in that area has led to an abundance of scam supplement hawkers[1] but I don't think the right conclusion to draw from that is that all criticisms of food regulation are in bad faith - I think it's very fair to say "We should have a serious discussion about our food quality and also we need to crack down on these BS supplements". I think we're all[2] pretty well aligned on the fact that the BS supplements need the crack down but we also should introspect on why so many people are motivated to seek things like that out.

1. I personally enjoy a can of hogwater every day and am happy to give you a referral code.

2. Except those who financially benefit from hawking snake oil, of course.

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#82

Post by munk-a »

mikem170 wrote: post #33
dfxm12 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1MM in any currency doesn't sound like a lot, especially relative to who they're up against...

Sounds like enough to pay some people for some months or a year or two - a combination of experts, part-time specialists, cotractors, etc. - to do things like gather some data via their contacts, hack together a meta-study, put out a glossy report andsome press releases, etc.

I think the bigger point is that there's an overwhelming amount of money going to push the opposite narrative. A quick search revealed that Tyson alone spends well over a million annually on lobbying and I am sure the industry at large spends significantly more on this issue alone.

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#83

Post by worik »

MathMonkeyMan wrote: post #37
arthurjj wrote: post #13

I'm about as hippie with my food as you can get, but this "article" is badly written propaganda that conceals more than it reveals. Half way down the article you learn that ~80% (193 out of 239) of the lawsuits are in Mexico and > many of them were against the country’s labelling regulation. Quinto Elemento Lab reveals the companies’ arguments: that the laws were a violation of their constitutional rights But the art…

Mexico is serious about junk food. The cereal boxes in the stores don't have cute cartoon characters on them, and I tried to send somebody a box of chocolates and it got seized by customs. Candy is labeled like cigarettes.

Good on them. More civilised than their northern neighbors

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#84

Post by perpetuallunch »

yndoendo wrote: post #68
irthomasthomas wrote: post #22

"Senators don't have the luxury that a research scientist has of waiting for evidence." - 1977 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbFQc2kxm9c FYI obesity 1977 ~14% 2026 40%+ T2 Diabetes 1977 ~3% 2026 ~12%

I would say the idea aged poorly in the USA. Older generation of politicians were more welcoming to experts in their fields. Now they reject the experts. Either to a please their voter base or for personal profit. Big grocery has more money for political donations / legal bribery. USA Supreme Court conservative judges have ruled that expertise has no value in a ruling against protecting the environment from toxic che…

Are you talking about the June 2024 decision that scraps the Chevron defence?

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#85

Post by danw1979 »

arthurjj wrote: post #13

I'm about as hippie with my food as you can get, but this "article" is badly written propaganda that conceals more than it reveals. Half way down the article you learn that ~80% (193 out of 239) of the lawsuits are in Mexico and > many of them were against the country’s labelling regulation. Quinto Elemento Lab reveals the companies’ arguments: that the laws were a violation of their constitutional rights But the art…

Maybe Mexico got it’s shit together and started doing something about the obesity crisis and the food industry is desperately trying to keep the status quo ?

Or maybe, to paraphrase the famous tweet, this is actually a plucky band of Mexican fizzy drinks manufacturers who are determined to expose the lies of 97% of the worlds health scientists.

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#86

Post by arthurjj »

titanomachy wrote: post #66
arthurjj wrote: post #13

I'm about as hippie with my food as you can get, but this "article" is badly written propaganda that conceals more than it reveals. Half way down the article you learn that ~80% (193 out of 239) of the lawsuits are in Mexico and > many of them were against the country’s labelling regulation. Quinto Elemento Lab reveals the companies’ arguments: that the laws were a violation of their constitutional rights But the art…

I don’t know that the lack of information should lead you to assume that the Mexico lawsuits are justified. From what I’ve read, they’re contesting (among other things) the mandated black octagon on the front of packaging that says “exceso calorías” or “exceso azucáres” (excessive calories and sugar) and also bans on advertising to children. The cases that have already been decided have overwhelmingly been in favor o…

Thanks for explaining what the lawsuits were about. I'm not sure how I feel about the actual case or even how effective I think black octagons will be. Apparently they were first done in Chile and had little to no long term effect [1]

My assumption that the suits were just was because the article obviously wants you to come away with a very specific conclusion, for example there is a sibling comment that seems to think these cases are about US companies. When reading clearly biased but polished, sources my default is to assume any facts they prominently leave out they did so on purpose.

[1] https://archive.is/UPdWg#selection-1493.0-1498.0

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#87

Post by worik »

nickff wrote: post #10

The measures related to lawsuits are misleading and terrible, because of the way class-action lawsuits have incentivized lawyers to pursue dubious cases against large companies.

This report is about something completely different

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#89

Post by Forgeties79 »

shermantanktop wrote: post #42
thegrim33 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have to learn to recognize the patterns. In this case, lighthouse reports is an international NGO which receives on the order of ~1MM in income per year (an extremely common pattern for these NGOs), which was directly given to them by (unspecified) government grants and (unnamed) private donors (can see all this in their openly published annual reports). In exchange for the funding (80.38% of which they paid o…

I think you are saying "an NGO probably has an agenda." Ok, sure, they are not robots with no opinions, and if you read even the first few sentences of that report you can see the opinion. But if you are suggesting that this NGO is carrying water for some unspecified shadowy group that is pulling the strings, you'll need to provide some backing for that. Who has a nefarious motivation to oppose junk food? Trial lawye…

Unfortunately in the current political climate “NGO” is just a hop and a step away from saying “the deep state” for some people. They vaguely gesture to it and talk about it as if it’s a bogeyman.

Not saying they are specifically doing that, but I can’t confidently say they aren’t either

Re: Big Food vs. the People

#90

Post by perpetuallunch »

triceratops wrote: post #79
sellmesoap wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alright, this week it's the marketing departments turn in jail, see you guys back here next week when it's HRs turn!

On the bright side, an ironclad excuse to skip the team offsite /s

Maybe they could incascerate the plant and equipment.

This week half the photocopiers are in foster care (prison).

Next week, half the backup generators.

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