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AI in Linux

drewdevault.com

11–20 of 106 posts

Re: AI in Linux

#11
>The same process is pricing regular people out of the energy they need to power their air conditioner during those heat waves and the technology it enables is pushing them out of the labor market and into poverty.

I don't see evidence this is true, and the critical mass of data centers is making electricity cheaper. Economies of scale -> more energy = bigger electric plants = cheaper energy.

https://netchoice.org/new-study-confirms-what-weve-been-sayi...

Re: AI in Linux

#12
From the title, I was hoping this was going to be a story about the major AI distros agreeing on an API and basic AI capabilities to be included in Linux just like Microsoft and Apple have done with their operating systems.

Instead, it's:

> how many tons of CO₂ added to the atmosphere or liters of fresh water supplies disrupted is a tolerable price for a better code review?

The answer isn't zero, is it?

Re: AI in Linux

#13

tl;dr Kernel devs should prompt less because it uses up water or something. Repeat after me: you can't put the cat back in the bag. Pandora's box is open. Sucks, but you have to learn to live with the reality that most developers will use AI to write code from now on.

There are many arguments one could make in favor of keeping AI around and using it, but your "argument" here is just about the lousiest and most naive argument one could possibly make, and shows a complete lack of empathy and understanding from your end.

Re: AI in Linux

#14
Torvalds' statement was incredibly disingenuous and rather sad. Every single commit is making a legal and political claim. Each commit is saying "this code is my original copyrighted work, and I am licensing it to the world per the requirements of the GNU GPLv2" (or "this code is someone else's work which was licensed under a compatible license, and I am integrating it into this GNU GPLv2 project").

That's not social warrior, that's simple facts. We don't need to try and guess motives or reasoning for people's contributions - that doesn't matter. What we have is an explicit declaration by virtue of the license, that the code being provided can legally be included in the GNU GPLv2 licensed "Linux" kernel. But with LLM generated code, this legal claim is dubious at best. For trivial (!= simple) code, one can probably argue that the LLM code will not be violating anyone's copyright, however for anything remotely novel, unless you are 100% certain that all of the training data was GPLv2 or compatible, it is not legally safe to use - and aside from that, even if all the training data was compatible with the license, the LLM will virtually always fail to properly attribute the source of its output, which is a requirement of - as far as I can tell - every license compatible with the GNU GPLv2. I cannot share GPL'd code and misrepresent it as my original work, I still have to make clear that it was someone else's creation.

LLM generated code is a ticking time bomb, and is going to poison projects.

Yes, it is possible to do this already without LLMs, but not by accident. A developer would have to make a conscious decision to violate someone's license in the past. Now it can happen without anyone being the wiser.

And as someone who very much uses GNU GPL licensed software because of its license, this worries me for the future of software. On technical merits, it doesn't matter, but if you care at all about the artful expression of software, as well as honesty about who created what, this should concern you.

Re: AI in Linux

#15
post #10
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tens of thousands of people dying as a direct result of global warming! Not a problem! /s

No ones dead because Linux devs prompted a chat bot

No one is dead because I launched a nuclear missile.

That doesn't mean I _should_ be given access to a nuclear missile.

Re: AI in Linux

#16
post #4

I read through this and must have missed it, but I don't see a single example of AI use in the Linux kernel development posing a problem.

The article isn't trying to find a particular example. It's talking about the overall stance of Linux on AI use. It argues that maintainers should consider political/moral/ethical arguments around climate change, effect on water supplies, energy prices, etc.

Re: AI in Linux

#17
post #4

I read through this and must have missed it, but I don't see a single example of AI use in the Linux kernel development posing a problem.

The thing I'd worry about is it slowly handing over control of Linux's direction to the tech companies who control and regulate the AI being used to help develop it. The complexity is only growing. These companies are themselves extremely political and decide what AI is and isn't legal when Linux demands using the most capable models for security reasons. So it would be good at least if the project actually cared and had it's own principles besides ignoring the politics.

Re: AI in Linux

#19
post #10
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tens of thousands of people dying as a direct result of global warming! Not a problem! /s

No ones dead because Linux devs prompted a chat bot

Temperatures during heat waves are exceeding 50°C in India, causing tens thousands of deaths. The AI built-out is by far the fastest growing energy consumer in the world, and they’re being built with fossil fuels, or drawing green energy demand away from replacing the fossil fuels depended on by other industries.

Re: AI in Linux

#20
post #5

tl;dr Kernel devs should prompt less because it uses up water or something. Repeat after me: you can't put the cat back in the bag. Pandora's box is open. Sucks, but you have to learn to live with the reality that most developers will use AI to write code from now on.

This is a really disingenuous way to characterize the article (CO2 and global warming were much more of a focus than water, so your "or something" is doing a lot of work). Furthermore your comment ignores key arguments in the article, particularly the argument that contributors should not be forced to participate in AI-based ceremonies such as LLM code review that they may object to on personal ethical grounds.

> Pandora's box is open.

And it's not Linux' task to close that, even if it could, which it cannot. How is that disingenuous?

I agree that we should keep discussing the merits and dangers of AI-aided software development. Broad, so indeed also CO2 etc. But that discussion is not something that Linux should push forward. It's a discussion that should take place outside the context of specific projects and in the context of the AI tools and providers, IMO.

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