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Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

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Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#21

Post by inigyou »

not_a9 wrote: post #14
LoganDark wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't really develop a kernel-mode driver nowadays without being an incredibly large OEM. Otherwise, you won't be accepted by any anti-cheat.

If anti-cheats actively whitelisted drivers playing competitive video games would be impossible for people using any rarer HW/utilities. Vulnerable drivers are generally blacklisted when found. Getting your driver signed seems like a pain these days, yeah

Yes this is how they work. You use a mainstream GPU or no game for you!

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#22

Post by not_a9 »

inigyou wrote: post #21
not_a9 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anti-cheats actively whitelisted drivers playing competitive video games would be impossible for people using any rarer HW/utilities. Vulnerable drivers are generally blacklisted when found. Getting your driver signed seems like a pain these days, yeah

Yes this is how they work. You use a mainstream GPU or no game for you!

Throw a lawn dart at the contents of https://vx-underground.org/Archive/Driver%20Collection/Bulk%... all drivers download, load the resulting driver and try to get into Fortnite or something. It'll probably get in fine assuming driver isn't Unknowncheats superstar already

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#24

Post by kg »

nananana9 wrote: post #16
pjmlp wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Certainly OpenGL and DirectX acceleration was a thing in Windows 9x, kind of missing the point.

Videocards of the era only did exclusive fullscreen - you could not for example use OpenGL to render your windowed application's UI, that was all software.

I don't think this is true? I remember successfully using OpenGL and Direct3D acceleration in windowed mode on 9x devices.

Are you thinking of the add-on 3D accelerator cards that did VGA pass-through from your 2D accelerator? It might've been true for them...

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#25

Post by atq2119 »

userbinator wrote: post #2

Developing our own KMD is not really an option Why not? Fully open-source Windows GPU drivers would be great. Incidentally, this sort of "glue code" is probably something LLM assistance could help greatly with much of the grunt work. (E.g. there is already a generic framebuffer driver for Win3x/9x: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47646363 but one of the ideas I have --- which anyone else with the time is more th…

In order to have a useful Windows desktop, you need a DX12 driver.

So, in order to write their own KMD, they'd either have to also write their own DX12 driver, which they probably have no interest in, or reverse engineer the existing AMD KMD interface to the point where they can reimplement it basically completely so that AMD's proprietary DX12 driver runs on it.

I doubt they're saying it's impossible, it's more of a pick your battles situation.

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#26

Post by happymellon »

atq2119 wrote: post #25
userbinator wrote: post #2

Developing our own KMD is not really an option Why not? Fully open-source Windows GPU drivers would be great. Incidentally, this sort of "glue code" is probably something LLM assistance could help greatly with much of the grunt work. (E.g. there is already a generic framebuffer driver for Win3x/9x: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47646363 but one of the ideas I have --- which anyone else with the time is more th…

In order to have a useful Windows desktop, you need a DX12 driver. So, in order to write their own KMD, they'd either have to also write their own DX12 driver, which they probably have no interest in, or reverse engineer the existing AMD KMD interface to the point where they can reimplement it basically completely so that AMD's proprietary DX12 driver runs on it. I doubt they're saying it's impossible , it's more of…

> in order to write their own KMD, they'd either have to also write their own DX12 driver

You mean Vulkan driver. We can run DX12 on Vulkan.

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#27

Post by Sweepi »

> New generation is so oversensitive: We were experimenting on Gen 11 hardware (RX 7900 XT) while Faith was working with a 10th Gen GPU (RX 7800 XT). We weren't able to replicate Faith's results for quite a while, due to architecture changes between these two generations.

... they are both RDNA3?

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#28

Post by userbinator »

Almondsetat wrote: post #12
LoganDark wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't really develop a kernel-mode driver nowadays without being an incredibly large OEM. Otherwise, you won't be accepted by any anti-cheat.

So we should throw away the possibility entirely just because of a few videogames? That doesn't sound reasonable at all, considering most videogames don't have anti cheats and GPUs can be used for way more stuff than playing.

Exactly, being able to use a local LLM or other generative AI on a machine running Win95 would itself be sufficiently entertaining.

Re: Cracking Windows Open: Porting RADV to Win32

#29

Post by atq2119 »

happymellon wrote: post #26
atq2119 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In order to have a useful Windows desktop, you need a DX12 driver. So, in order to write their own KMD, they'd either have to also write their own DX12 driver, which they probably have no interest in, or reverse engineer the existing AMD KMD interface to the point where they can reimplement it basically completely so that AMD's proprietary DX12 driver runs on it. I doubt they're saying it's impossible , it's more of…

> in order to write their own KMD, they'd either have to also write their own DX12 driver You mean Vulkan driver. We can run DX12 on Vulkan.

Do you mean on Linux in a Wine/Proton context? That's different, so yes, I did mean DX12 driver.

Again, not impossible, just picking your battles.

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