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The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

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Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#351

Post by ghaff »

Aurornis wrote: post #100
paxys wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If someone doesn’t have $400 to buy out the residual then I doubt they would have had the cash to pay for the whole thing up front. That’s the entire point. They would have bought a cheaper phone, or held on to their old one, but are now paying perpetual monthly payments. There’s a reason car dealerships never ask “how much can you afford”, but “how much do you want to pay every month”. There’s a reason Klarna is r…

You know those financially irresponsible people don’t need this program, right? They would have used a credit card to buy it with much worse terms You seem tilted at Apple for offering a financing option, but your real gripe is apparently with some people who have poor financial decision making skills. Those people could (and probably would) do a lot worse with traditional options like a credit card. Can we at least…

Leasing is just a financial transaction. You need to run the numbers, evaluate the alternatives, and peer at least a bit into the future. I've never leased a car and I doubt I'd lease a phone if only to keep my options open. (At the moment, I'm in the situation where I trashed an older phone on a hiking trip so I'll probably upgrade my iPhone 15 Pro sooner than I otherwise would just so I have a usable backup while traveling again.)

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#352

Post by ghaff »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #242
edoceo wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From that lens this is a better option for the "buyer" (renter). Cause revolving credit is >10%, sometimes even more than 15%!

15%? Oh, sweet summer child... https://wallethub.com/answers/cc/highest-credit-card-interes...

Those numbers aren't typical but it's still the case that credit cards generally have significantly higher interest rates if you don't pay in full by the due date than just about any other sort of loan (that admittedly not everyone can qualify for).

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#353

Post by mattlutze »

An interesting lesson from the "certified pre-owned" programs in automakers and mobile network providers.

Permanent "leasers" swap devices every few years, stocking the company's second-hand options and increasing average lifetime value of the participating products.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#354

Post by Fluorescence »

ameliaquining wrote: post #285
monk_grilla wrote: post #280

Can anyone explain why Apple needed Klarna for this? They have Apple Card so presumably they are capable of providing financial services like loans on their own, why bring in a third party who will take a cut and force your consumers onto their app with a bad reputation?

Apple absolutely does not provide Apple Card in-house, and in particular is not loaning you the money when you use it. Among many other reasons, for that to be legal would require Apple to be a bank, which they're not and they definitely don't want to be, because being a bank is a huge pain, and in particular means signing up for an extremely heavyweight regulatory compliance regime. Apple Card is the result of a co-…

> because Klarna already specializes in precisely this kind of transaction

I think Apple gets sweetheart deals so their partners often lose money. Klarna likely sees this as a marketing coup to have their predatory sussness promoted by the Apple halo brand.

If there was profit to be had, I'm sure Apple could buy a small bank and spin it off as a subsidiary with little drama, it's just not the best of their options.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#355

Post by abanana »

blackqueeriroh wrote: post #266
olyjohn wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean... what kind of hobby is owning the latest phone? Especially when the latest phone is barely an upgrade over the previous one.

Do you know what’s cool about hobbies? They don’t have to be reasonable! They don’t have to be financially responsible! They’re hobbies! That’s the whole point! Listen, whatever you do that’s your hobby I’m certain is also a giant waste of money and very financially irresponsible. And if not, learn how to have fun and stop being so boring.

> They don’t have to be financially responsible

They do if you don't have the money to throw away. That's the whole point - far too often, the people who throw their money away on these things are the same people who spend all their time complaining they're struggling to afford the basics, like feeding their family.

Yes it's fine if you have plenty of money to waste on what you enjoy, but the majority of people don't.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#357

Post by abanana »

sneak wrote: post #303
horsawlarway wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand this mindset. I get that people who are going to upgrade to the latest flagship phone every 18-24 months will probably do better with this, but realistically... those people are fucking insanely financially irresponsible (and if you can afford it - no shade, I guess, its your money - lord knows I burn lots of cash on hobby projects of my own, although I tend to buy things that are actually projects…

> I get that people who are going to upgrade to the latest flagship phone every 18-24 months will probably do better with this, but realistically... those people are fucking insanely financially irresponsible This is not remotely true. I buy each and every flagship iPhone every year on or near release day for cash. I have done so every release since the first iPhone came out. Each September or October my old phone go…

> way less than $200 per month... $2k per year

For the vast majority of consumers, these prices are insane.

> trivial amount of money... I’m not even an extreme outlier

It's also true that the majority of high-earners refuse to understand that they're in the top few percent for income. I'm not sure whether what I'm reading here is a sincere mistaken belief - the general psychological effect where a person believes their own sense of "normal" is normal to everyone - or a deliberate attempt to get a rise out of other commenters.

> another 10-20k per year on computer software and services, because it assists my business in making many times that in revenue... replace my $7k work laptop every 12-24 months

So those are business costs? They don't belong in this discussion.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#358

Post by ghaff »

Onawa wrote: post #287
olyjohn wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My screen is cracked, and I still prefer it over a case. Just a personal preference, I think.

Phones these days are so slippery without a case though... Is it just me? Feels like trying to hold on to a wet bar of soap sans case.

I don't think so. Maybe I'm just used to it but I like the gripiness of my Otterbox case in addition to the protection it provides. My prior iPhoen might have survived a hiking trip if I had an equivalently robust case (and the newer Otterbox Defender cases are much less clunky than the older ones were).

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#359

Post by ghaff »

prmoustache wrote: post #323
Onawa wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Phones these days are so slippery without a case though... Is it just me? Feels like trying to hold on to a wet bar of soap sans case.

Disregarding the commodity of a big screen, they have the wrong shape to be honest for something that is made to be handled.

I've handled the Maxes and they're just too big for my taste. It's not a financial thing. I'm by no means a phone size minimalist but my 15 Pro feels like just the right size for a phone at this point.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#360

Post by ghaff »

sneak wrote: post #304
GolfPopper wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a little confused on why anyone would pay this much for a phone. (Although if you consider it conspicuous consumption that happens to work as a phone, I can believe that.)

I’ve always been told when computer shopping to “buy the fastest cpu and the most ram you can afford”. This goes doubly for revenue-generating devices. My iPhone is the computer I use most every day, by a WIDE margin.

>"buy the fastest cpu and the most ram you can afford”.

I would append "subject to diminishing returns" for your use cases.

I could afford maxed-out computers (within reason) but, for most purposes, the premiums for the very top-of-line exceeds any discernible increase in functionality I would experience.

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