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National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

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Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#31

Post by diego_moita »

Lendal wrote: post #8

The irony is this will harm US manufacturing, not help it. Manufacturing is the sector that most depends on robotics. Companies will now have to sue the administration so they can continue operations without this new regulatory hindrance. I thought this president was supposed to eliminate regulations, not impose newer and stupider ones.

In the 80s Brazil went that same path. They made a law forbidding everyone from importing computers. The idea was to "develop a national computer industry".

They created a monstrosity. The Brazilian made computers were always one generation behind the foreign ones (AT 286 was a "new" thing when every country was going into 386) and would cost 3 times more. Computers smuggled from Paraguay were everywhere, even I smuggled some.

The IT industry in Brazil became a cartel dominated by few companies. They'd pirate everything from the Americans, even DOS and all BIOS and firmware. Their computers' mainboards were ugly, hacked and defect prone. But they would give buckets of money to the military controlling the government and the corrupt politicians in Congress. The 80s became known as the "lost decade" because of the low growth induced by this policy.

This dumb idea expired in 1992.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#32

Post by anticorporate »

kotaKat wrote: post #26
logicchains wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will harm it even more by not subjecting it to competition, so it becomes bloated and uncompetitive like the US car and shipbuilding industries.

This is just a false-flag campaign planted by the UAW to ensure the slovenly can keep their jobs another couple years instead of actually be held to task for poor American manufacturing build quality. ;)

When you can't blame the machines, pretend the workers on the lowest rungs are machines and blame them instead.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#33

Post by InsideOutSanta »

Lendal wrote: post #8

The irony is this will harm US manufacturing, not help it. Manufacturing is the sector that most depends on robotics. Companies will now have to sue the administration so they can continue operations without this new regulatory hindrance. I thought this president was supposed to eliminate regulations, not impose newer and stupider ones.

I read somebody point out that the cold war roles have reversed. Now the US is protectionist and isolationist, and the likely eventual outcome will be the same for the US as it was for the USSR.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#34

Post by diego_moita »

I see a funny pattern here.

England created the Industrial Revolution but barely has any manufacturing these days.

The U.S. created several industries (mass car manufacturing, electronics, clothing, etc) but today China produces more than them. They had more than half the worlds' GDP in 1944, they have less than 16% today. They're slowly following England's path.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#35

Post by m4rtink »

diego_moita wrote: post #31
Lendal wrote: post #8

The irony is this will harm US manufacturing, not help it. Manufacturing is the sector that most depends on robotics. Companies will now have to sue the administration so they can continue operations without this new regulatory hindrance. I thought this president was supposed to eliminate regulations, not impose newer and stupider ones.

In the 80s Brazil went that same path. They made a law forbidding everyone from importing computers. The idea was to "develop a national computer industry". They created a monstrosity. The Brazilian made computers were always one generation behind the foreign ones (AT 286 was a "new" thing when every country was going into 386) and would cost 3 times more. Computers smuggled from Paraguay were everywhere, even I smug…

I though Brazil still has these weird tariffs on computers and high tech products in general - at least I've heard from some Brazilians that it's still making personal computing hardware far too expensive wioth little to no benefit to this day.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#36

Post by jbstack »

hn_submit wrote: post #12

Why doesn't the U.S. simply ban all Chinese products that have an internet-connected computer in them? That would solve almost all security problems in one strike and force Chinese manufacturers to communicate via Bluetooth and update software through USB sticks or memory cards. The apps communicating with said devices through Bluetooth obviously can't connect to the internet either otherwise there'd still be an aven…

Removing an internet connection doesn't really solve much when you're talking about autonomous AI-driven robots with vision and hearing. It's a whole different category to toys, refrigerators, etc. My refrigerator isn't going to suddenly pick up a weapon and start attacking things on command. Nor does it have an easy way to receive instructions through side channels. I'm not saying I agree with Trump's policy - but removing internet isn't a solution either.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#37

Post by nono_ninja »

hn_submit wrote: post #12

Why doesn't the U.S. simply ban all Chinese products that have an internet-connected computer in them? That would solve almost all security problems in one strike and force Chinese manufacturers to communicate via Bluetooth and update software through USB sticks or memory cards. The apps communicating with said devices through Bluetooth obviously can't connect to the internet either otherwise there'd still be an aven…

Probably why you couldn't ban all at once...there'd be not much left.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#38

Post by ExoticPearTree »

I hope there's a plan for local production in the US with all the banning of stuff right, left and center.

Soon they'll ban Colombian coffee for being too good and making people want more of it. Or who knows whatever else.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#39

Post by ExoticPearTree »

revolvingthrow wrote: post #13

Ah, the newly popular "let's make the policy unusually broad and treat all foreign production as presumptively dangerous, regardless of country, manufacturer or security practices, this way we're more transparent about prioritizing a bribe rather than our stated concerns". > Advanced robotic devices are inherently networked systems which creates broad attack surfaces and leaves them vulnerable to data exfiltration, r…

> Good thing this isn't a concern in ones produced locally.

Local ones when not in use are doing the Pledge of Allegiance on a loop.

Re: National Security Determination Threat Posed by Foreign-Produced Robotic Devices [pdf]

#40

Post by Tangurena2 »

revolvingthrow wrote: post #13

Ah, the newly popular "let's make the policy unusually broad and treat all foreign production as presumptively dangerous, regardless of country, manufacturer or security practices, this way we're more transparent about prioritizing a bribe rather than our stated concerns". > Advanced robotic devices are inherently networked systems which creates broad attack surfaces and leaves them vulnerable to data exfiltration, r…

I think this policy is another case of projection: "we" are doing this to other countries and we are afraid someone will do it back to us - which is both unfair and illegal.
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