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Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

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Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#141

Post by MaKey »

chvid wrote: post #135
joshka wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you square away the idea that you do science for the increase in knowledge of human kind, but then say that a particular use of that knowledge is verboten? I get the copyright aspect of this and I'm not arguing that here. I'm more asking about the moral / ethical idea of choosing who can benefit from your science. Obviously there are the moral / ethical arguments about AI in general here to weigh against - tho…

How are you sure that what big ai is doing is “the increase in knowledge of human kind”? It is good for their business model; but it may lead to monopoly unlike anything acm ever had and very dubious prospect for academia.

> How are you sure that what big ai is doing is “the increase in knowledge of human kind”?

The OP didn't say that.

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#142

Post by master-lincoln »

b112 wrote: post #129
evenhash wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nobody is saying we’re going to make the original content inaccessible through the previous means after the LLMs are trained on it. Is that not why they’re shredding the books when they’re done with them?

How is this a fair and reasonable assessment? From here: https://x.com/HedgieMarkets/status/2081534588485296565 A quote: A federal judge ruled the practice is fair use because eliminating the original means only one copy exists at a time. So no, the reason isn't to keep that information, even from competitors. It's about a legal ruling, which allows them to scan said books without infringing copyright. Judicial decis…

They asked a question. I saw no rumor spread.

Gotta love that ridiculous case law system :D

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#143

Post by b112 »

master-lincoln wrote: post #142
b112 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this a fair and reasonable assessment? From here: https://x.com/HedgieMarkets/status/2081534588485296565 A quote: A federal judge ruled the practice is fair use because eliminating the original means only one copy exists at a time. So no, the reason isn't to keep that information, even from competitors. It's about a legal ruling, which allows them to scan said books without infringing copyright. Judicial decis…

They asked a question. I saw no rumor spread. Gotta love that ridiculous case law system :D

Well, sometimes a ? is rhetorical, and meant as a statement and not a question. But fair enough. And yes, I do believe the outcome is silly here.

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#144

Post by bonoboTP »

20k wrote: post #107
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure you didn’t have RAG enabled and it wasn’t putting the paper in its context for your prompt? I find it hard to believe that anything but the most commonly published papers/code would exist directly in model weights.

I've seen: 1. AI models frequently output large chunks of code which are plagiarised. In one specific case it was code for walking the stack, that was a clear mix of two original sources that I was able to find with changed variable names, but the structure was identical and switched from the first to the second halfway through 2. AI models plagiarising stack overflow answers word for word, quite recently about the r…

If it never regurgitated the exact same thing, would you accept AI then?

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#145

Post by [deleted] »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #140
jval43 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My ACM papers are published in full on my website. Not preprints. In fact thats the only reason I have a website, just in case someone actually wants to read them. The copyright agreement (actually copyright assignment/transfer) with ACM has had a carve-out for this case in it for a while, but it has to be a personal website.

I thought it was more liberal than that but there was always a “preprint” exemption that would get you around it.

[deleted]

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#146

Post by Rochus »

Scientific publications (including ACM) should be openly accessible to anyone. I find it very annoying that there is a paywall everywhere. And for the (few) people here seeing AI as something useful, it's definitely better if it is trained on scientific publications than on e.g. Reddit discussions.

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#147

Post by eloisius »

preisschild wrote: post #139
lazide wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think big AI is going to just share all it’s ‘knowledge’?

Exactly. Companies like Anthropic do not want open access. See their FUD against "distillation attacks"

I keep coming to this thought too. If we really get to the point that AI can produce all the software we need, do any knowledge work we need, why wouldn't Big AI just use it to do that and take you out of the loop? Are "AI developers" making the flashlight app in the App Store right now?

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#148

Post by inigyou »

avereveard wrote: post #130
bonoboTP wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, then next question is why are you in academia? To share knowledge with humanity, bring the Promethean light to the mortals or something I guess. But then if they use it for productive things that make money, that's too smelly, that's too practical, too dirty, or what?

Grants.They want the juicy grants and complain of the strings attached. Guess the single strongest predictor of paper in field per year?

You really think a researcher is just a pointless intermediary in shovelling money from the government to the publishing rackets?

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#149

Post by inigyou »

aragilar wrote: post #132
PeterStuer wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why not license it for free to those model companies that also share their models with the public? Why would Moonshot not get free access?

Why not give everyone access for free?

Some guys calling themselves Anna did that. As well as Aaron Swartz before them.

Re: Now is the time to give LLMs access to the ACM digital library

#150

Post by inigyou »

aatd86 wrote: post #65
layer8 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s pretty clear that the premise won’t be becoming reality.

Well, once there is no more jobs, or once a large enough number of people are made redundant, it will mechanically happen. Future is all about research and entertainment. That is why tiktok stars and soccer players get so much money. All that being based on DARPA research, I mean the internet. People just want to have fun. Du pain et des jeux.

You wish it would happen. It could happen by the laws of physics. But it won't happen by the laws of politics. The redundant people will be culled from existence instead, one way or another.
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