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The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

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Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#271

Post by beacon294 »

horsawlarway wrote: post #215
0x457 wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, lets do math: - from this thread: iPhone 17 pro max would be $1199 to buy (~1273 with tax) or $34.99 for 24 months totaling $839.76. So would cost 433.33 at the end of the lease to keep it If you upgrade your phone every 1-2 years then what you pay for the phone is something like "full cost - optimistic trade-in value". I see no reason not to do if you know you going to upgrade.

I don't understand this mindset. I get that people who are going to upgrade to the latest flagship phone every 18-24 months will probably do better with this, but realistically... those people are fucking insanely financially irresponsible (and if you can afford it - no shade, I guess, its your money - lord knows I burn lots of cash on hobby projects of my own, although I tend to buy things that are actually projects…

LLMs are set to.increase hardware demands a lot. Although I don't necessarily think this is related to the program change.

I know this comment is deep in a thread, but to me it looks like they simply prefer to own the whole apple device payment cycle and not use partners.

BNPL has been a huge bubble outside the traditional credit bubble, this is the same. It doesn't seem like a big divergence excepting that it gives them a contact point and a stick with which to prod customer into a new phone sooner.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#272

Post by zwily »

dgellow wrote: post #77
fckgw wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They still have a 12mo lease term if you want to upgrade yearly.

Wait, do people actually upgrade yearly? I always thought it was hyperbolic

Every year since the first iPhone came out. It's sort of superstition at this point. Not sure what would happen if I broke the streak.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#273

Post by blackqueeriroh »

Zambyte wrote: post #154
dzonga wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you overestimate the financial health of most Americans. most people live on credit cards as bridge finance between paychecks. when I mean most people - I mean 50% of the population.

There are phones that cost a lot less though. 50% of Americans being unable to afford iPhones doesn't mean they should just lease them. People need to stop associating so much personal sense of worth with their handheld computer. - written on my S10

> People need to stop associating so much personal sense of worth with their handheld computer.

This might be the funniest thing I’ve ever read on this nerd website.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#274

Post by blackqueeriroh »

paxys wrote: post #211
tshaddox wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the 0% APR financing essentially just a sales expense? Even if people generally don't immediately roll into another 2-year agreement, the main reason zero-interest financing works for the sellers is simply that it makes it easier for people to spend money on expensive high-margin stuff. Multi-year zero-interest loans are also commonplace in high-price, high-margin specialty retail: think La-Z-Boy, Sleep Number,…

They also charge heavy interest and fees to people who miss payments, but in this case that will be captured by Klarna.

Klarna does not charge interest or fees to people who miss payments.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#275

Post by isaachinman »

jghn wrote: post #108

Technically my current iPhone is part of the upgrade program, but I paid if off years ago. Why haven't I upgraded? Because there's no mini and all they make are phablets now.

iPhone 15 Pro is a reasonable size, in my opinion. Still large compared to years past.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#276

Post by apparent »

blackqueeriroh wrote: post #270
apparent wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So the goal of the program is the same as every other similar one - they want to turn a one-time device purchase into a perpetual monthly revenue stream, while keeping ownership of the asset at the end. Yep, which reduces the need to make new devices notably better than old ones, since you'll always have a steady stream of customers coming off their leases.

Are you seriously arguing that Apple is doing this so they don’t have to keep making devices any better? I just want to be very clear about this.

That gets it backwards. They're not doing this because they want to make devices that are less compelling purchases, but they are aware that their coming pipeline will in general not as be compelling to potential upgraders as in the past. This is largely because the category has matured, and people don't feel the need to upgrade nearly as often as 5-10 years ago.

By getting people to be default-subscribers rather than purchasers who may decide to upgrade, they improve their odds of keeping a larger chunk of their hardware revenue stream.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#277

Post by blackqueeriroh »

s0rce wrote: post #151
smallmancontrov wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the days of Samuel Vimes, durable goods have undergone spectacular deflation and health care, housing, and education have undergone spectacular inflation. One month of median US rent buys three 55" TVs. The math has changed.

Durable goods also seem much less durable. I go through way more fridges, dishwashers, etc then previously.

Really? How many fridges have you gone through in 10 years? This might be the way you treat things, because for me and mine all of these are still a single digit: 1.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#278

Post by blackqueeriroh »

thisislife2 wrote: post #116
quickthrowman wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A lot of people aren’t going to have that $433 at the end of the lease to purchase the device outright If someone can’t plan ahead 2 years for a $433 expense, they definitely should not have a top of the line iPhone. When my income was low I had an iPhone SE that cost $329.

If everyone was as rational as you, Americans wouldn't be living in debt that most cannot afford. Most Indians have a healthy fear of debt, and that is why the iPhone doesn't have a larger share of the mobile phone market here as it really is unaffordable to most Indians (as it is for many in America). Americans however have accepted debt as a normal part of their lifestyle. When a rich man says poor people shouldn't…

This is not why Americans are in debt. If you really think this you understand so little.

That rich man was born into wealth, so he has no concept of the lives of poor people.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#279

Post by blackqueeriroh »

Grombobulous wrote: post #255
gruez wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Paying a $400 payment on a 2 year iPhone will look insane as that’s the depreciated value of a 2 year old phone. Check ebay. That's around the price of a pro series iPhone 2 years old.

That's exactly what I mean. If you're the person who has leased this phone, you make all your payments and get to the end and your bill to keep the phone forever is going to seem kind of high. Obviously, that's logical. In your lease, you have only paid the price of depreciation. Just like with cars leasing is the most expensive way to own them, but I guess there's a certain buyer who doesn't want old stuff.

You all really do not understand. Many people will gladly pay the $433 at the end because they’ve been able to get a new job and make more money in the interim.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#280

Post by monk_grilla »

Can anyone explain why Apple needed Klarna for this?

They have Apple Card so presumably they are capable of providing financial services like loans on their own, why bring in a third party who will take a cut and force your consumers onto their app with a bad reputation?

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