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The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

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Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#231

Post by tshaddox »

paxys wrote: post #211
tshaddox wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the 0% APR financing essentially just a sales expense? Even if people generally don't immediately roll into another 2-year agreement, the main reason zero-interest financing works for the sellers is simply that it makes it easier for people to spend money on expensive high-margin stuff. Multi-year zero-interest loans are also commonplace in high-price, high-margin specialty retail: think La-Z-Boy, Sleep Number,…

They also charge heavy interest and fees to people who miss payments, but in this case that will be captured by Klarna.

Yes, and for most of those retailers I mentioned the financing is handled by e.g. Synchrony Bank.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#232

Post by iamnothere »

malshe wrote: post #149
iamnothere wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For now

What makes you think Apple would not accept 100% payment today if someone wants to buy the device outright?

Today = now. So yes, they accept this, for now.

The way things are going, in the future I can see device makers deciding that a lease-only model might be preferable, both for recurring revenue and deeper control. If you don’t own your device, you can’t complain too loudly about right to repair, device restrictions, or software end-of-life.

A lease model would also prevent resale, so devices could be “verified” as belonging to a particular person for their entire lifetime. This simplifies the various verified identity schemes.

A lease model means that your lease could be revoked and your device bricked if you violate the terms. To “ensure good behavior”.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#233

Post by r0fl »

user00005 wrote: post #139

Well, Apple did just hit a 5 trillion market cap with a PE ratio of 41. With hardware prices increasing, selling financially challenged people on 'cheap' monthly payments seem like one way to keep the stock price pumped at these levels. I guess they are one of the good trillion corporations though? https://finance.yahoo.com/technology/article/apple-tops-5-tr...

“Financially challenged” people never paid for their phones with cash

They were probably using credit cards at 29% to buy the exact same phones that are now 0%

Net net it’s a win

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#234

Post by Danox »

dzonga wrote: post #140
tw600040 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone who won't have that $433 has no business even thinking about a 1200$ phone in the first place

you overestimate the financial health of most Americans. most people live on credit cards as bridge finance between paychecks. when I mean most people - I mean 50% of the population.

And those people never get to a point where they save anything, renting, leasing, pay as you go, credit cards, reverse mortgages are a losing game the house always wins.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#235

Post by underlipton »

Aurornis wrote: post #161
dzonga wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you overestimate the financial health of most Americans. most people live on credit cards as bridge finance between paychecks. when I mean most people - I mean 50% of the population.

The median US household has a net worth of $200,000. Even a 50th percentile US household is very wealthy by global standards. Credit card statistics are heavily manipulated because it's easy to make them sound terrible. I don't know which factoid specifically you're referring to, but the studies about "X percent of Americans couldn't handle an emergency expense without putting it on a credit card" often use tricks li…

>Even a 50th percentile US household is very wealthy by global standards.

Not by purchasing power. We're also in a weird position compared to our "peers" in that most of them have relatively easy access to much less wealthy neighbors via over-land transit or a cheap plane ride, whereas we have to travel quite a distance or pay for extremely expensive plane tickets. Which means that we're stuck here with what a USD buys in the US, instead of being able to hop over to someplace else where a dollar goes further. We also work more than our peers, so our per-hour earnings take a hit compared to theirs.

I could go on. The trick is trying to gaslight Americans into second-guessing the economic pain they've increasingly felt over the past few decades. The 50th percentile American household lives worse than the 50th percentile household of quite a few less-wealthy countries.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#236

Post by frmersdog »

Zambyte wrote: post #159
PunchyHamster wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

wait till you see what people do with car payments

Selling my car that I fully owned in favor of a nice bicycle and an e-scooter was one of my best financial decisions in the last few years. I don't have to deal with insurance, parking (if parking is free by you, it shouldn't be), maintenance (I work on them myself, I just pay for cheap parts), and fuel is effectively free. That's all on top of the car payment for people who haven't paid off their car.

Genuinely wish I had done so when I lost my job at the beginning of the pandemic. I've dumped so much money into a vehicle that's falling apart, which I've driven probably less than 25k miles since. If you can't justify car ownership with your income, they're a money pit.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#237

Post by notyourwork »

paxys wrote: post #65
nerdjon wrote: post #23

The math for the new program is kinda perplexing, my guess is that they are hoping that most people just will send in the device and upgrade. If I am reading the FAQ here properly: https://www.apple.com/shop/apple-upgrade . > If you decide to buy the device, the purchase option fee is the list price minus any lease payments you’ve made minus any remaining discounts or trade-in credit. (excluding tax and any damage fe…

> iPhone 17 pro max would be $1199 to buy (~1273 with tax) or $34.99 for 24 months totaling $839.76. So would cost 433.33 at the end of the lease to keep it A lot of people aren’t going to have that $433 at the end of the lease to purchase the device outright, and so will have to roll it into another 2-year monthly payment, and another one after that. So the goal of the program is the same as every other similar one…

Have to milk the economic tit for all it’s worth.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#238

Post by Danox »

Zambyte wrote: post #154
dzonga wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you overestimate the financial health of most Americans. most people live on credit cards as bridge finance between paychecks. when I mean most people - I mean 50% of the population.

There are phones that cost a lot less though. 50% of Americans being unable to afford iPhones doesn't mean they should just lease them. People need to stop associating so much personal sense of worth with their handheld computer. - written on my S10

For many that is their only computer in that context having a smartphone definitely isn’t a bad thing. What’s bad is not saving up to buy it. Do not buy it on credit if you don’t have to, however, it must be said that if you get an iPhone, it does have better resale value (all Apple computers, and iPads) have a longer lifespan software wise, probably more than most other smartphones, which comes back to the question why are you renting or leasing? Just buy it on time with minimum interest upfront if you absolutely must buy it? Owner of an 11 Pro iPhone from 2019. With one or two years of Apple software support left?

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#239

Post by dsl »

paxys wrote: post #119

I wonder what the reaction here would have been if Klarna had independently announced this program, instead of the current version which is Apple branded with a tiny “run by Klarna” in the footer.

Seeing as Apple is sunsetting a program that is far superior as a consumer, the two are not unrelated.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#240

Post by jghn »

JBAnderson5 wrote: post #129
jghn wrote: post #108

Technically my current iPhone is part of the upgrade program, but I paid if off years ago. Why haven't I upgraded? Because there's no mini and all they make are phablets now.

Will they ever come out with a new mini? If they don’t, is it possible to buy a new 13 mini anymore? Or just replace the battery?

Unlikely. I'm hoping when the foldable models come out that the folded version is a decent form factor. And then I can just not bother unfolding it.
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