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The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

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Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#191

Post by closetohome »

0x457 wrote: post #180
Mistletoe wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why on earth are we leasing phones now???

Well, lets do math: - from this thread: iPhone 17 pro max would be $1199 to buy (~1273 with tax) or $34.99 for 24 months totaling $839.76. So would cost 433.33 at the end of the lease to keep it If you upgrade your phone every 1-2 years then what you pay for the phone is something like "full cost - optimistic trade-in value". I see no reason not to do if you know you going to upgrade.

This math is what lead me to the iUp program in the first place. It's effectively a guaranteed 50% trade-in, which came out to about $200-300 in actual money that I was theoretically sacrificing in exchange for not having to worry about the cosmetic condition of the phone or weirdos on ebay.

And it came with AppleCare+ with Theft and Loss. I stopped using a case. I lived free.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#192

Post by ben1040 »

jborichevskiy wrote: post #157
_zie wrote: post #102

"If you’re leasing an iPhone, you’ll need to connect to AT&T, T-Mobile, or Verizon when you enroll." Damn, this is the dealbreaker for me. Leasing an unlocked iPhone and being able to use my current $25/mo MVNO of choice (US Mobile) may have actually tempted me (I currently buy outright and then tell myself I'll sell my current phone when I upgrade, but in reality I just have iPhone graveyard at home.)

It's a little unclear; they make you select a carrier, but buried in the fine print is: "For iPhone only: In order to lease an iPhone, you must select an eligible carrier (but you cannot use a prepaid carrier plan). A leased iPhone is always unlocked, so you can switch carriers at any time, subject to your carrier’s terms." So it... is unlocked? I am also on US Mobile and don't want to leave it

This is unchanged from the upgrade program terms before. The phone is unlocked, but when you take delivery of the phone you have to activate it on a Big 3 carrier's postpaid plan.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#193

Post by apparent »

paxys wrote: post #65
nerdjon wrote: post #23

The math for the new program is kinda perplexing, my guess is that they are hoping that most people just will send in the device and upgrade. If I am reading the FAQ here properly: https://www.apple.com/shop/apple-upgrade . > If you decide to buy the device, the purchase option fee is the list price minus any lease payments you’ve made minus any remaining discounts or trade-in credit. (excluding tax and any damage fe…

> iPhone 17 pro max would be $1199 to buy (~1273 with tax) or $34.99 for 24 months totaling $839.76. So would cost 433.33 at the end of the lease to keep it A lot of people aren’t going to have that $433 at the end of the lease to purchase the device outright, and so will have to roll it into another 2-year monthly payment, and another one after that. So the goal of the program is the same as every other similar one…

> So the goal of the program is the same as every other similar one - they want to turn a one-time device purchase into a perpetual monthly revenue stream, while keeping ownership of the asset at the end.

Yep, which reduces the need to make new devices notably better than old ones, since you'll always have a steady stream of customers coming off their leases.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#194

Post by Marsymars »

r0fl wrote: post #18

Leasing isn’t “I can’t afford to buy it.” It’s about capital allocation. Why would I tie up $1,200 upfront in a device that’s going to be obsolete in a couple of years when I can spread the cost over time, preserve cash flow, and (if it’s a legitimate business expense) deduct the lease payments? Keeping $1,200 in my business earning a return is often worth more than prepaying for a depreciating asset. People happily…

> People happily lease $80,000 vehicles for exactly these reasons.

Well, kinda. Various vehicles have fleet-only trim levels that are the cheapest models available. The reasons that you'd lease a $80k Ford F-150 Raptor are somewhat different than the reasons that you'd lease a $39k F-150 XL.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#195

Post by apparent »

Aurornis wrote: post #100
paxys wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If someone doesn’t have $400 to buy out the residual then I doubt they would have had the cash to pay for the whole thing up front. That’s the entire point. They would have bought a cheaper phone, or held on to their old one, but are now paying perpetual monthly payments. There’s a reason car dealerships never ask “how much can you afford”, but “how much do you want to pay every month”. There’s a reason Klarna is r…

You know those financially irresponsible people don’t need this program, right? They would have used a credit card to buy it with much worse terms You seem tilted at Apple for offering a financing option, but your real gripe is apparently with some people who have poor financial decision making skills. Those people could (and probably would) do a lot worse with traditional options like a credit card. Can we at least…

> You know those financially irresponsible people don’t need this program, right? They would have used a credit card to buy it with much worse terms

I thought of this also. The question is whether they will now spend even more on the phone since they won't be paying as much in interest. If so, it's savvy of Apple to suck up that difference instead of letting it go to credit card companies.

Presumably Klarna's share is lower because Apple is rumored to be able to nerf these devices if a series of payments are missed. [1]

1: https://9to5mac.com/2026/07/21/ios-27-code-suggests-apple-co...

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#196

Post by Aurornis »

dzonga wrote: post #179
Aurornis wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The median US household has a net worth of $200,000. Even a 50th percentile US household is very wealthy by global standards. Credit card statistics are heavily manipulated because it's easy to make them sound terrible. I don't know which factoid specifically you're referring to, but the studies about "X percent of Americans couldn't handle an emergency expense without putting it on a credit card" often use tricks li…

averages strike again. Median wealth in the U.S just around $100k - see Wikipedia & other databases. how many people own houses ? & for those people that own houses - average equity in those houses is less than 45%. ain't no factoid - but lived reality of most people. maybe on the coasts where techies and finance bros live - but the rest of america is facing a bleak financial reality.

> averages strike again.

My comment said "median" explicitly

The number was for household wealth. I think you're looking at individual wealth, which would naturally be lower because it's spread across more people.

Source: https://www.federalreserve.gov/econres/scf/dataviz/scf/table...

The average (mean) is closer to $1 million per family, but that's not a useful number.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#197

Post by apparent »

Interestingly, Apple is apparently going to be able to nerf the devices if the customer misses a series of payments. [1]

Presumably this ability means that Klarna has a lower risk of nonpayment, and is willing to accept a smaller cut of the total price from Apple.

1: https://9to5mac.com/2026/07/21/ios-27-code-suggests-apple-co...

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#198

Post by bredren »

bri3d wrote: post #69
wxw wrote: post #17

> To make way for Apple Upgrade — a new experience that offers more products and terms that work for you — we’re saying goodbye to the iPhone Upgrade Program. https://www.apple.com/shop/apple-upgrade It looks like this leasing program is just moving into a more generic/Apple-wide offering... not sure if the fine print changes. [edit: from the comments, it sounds like the difference is it was previously 0% interest fi…

It's "just" a restructuring; the previous setup was a really bizarre financial product where Citizens Bank gave you a 24-month 0% personal loan to buy an iPhone, but Apple would also buy your phone and loan out and sell you a new one every 12 months. Now it's just a normal lease product with a 0% money factor through Klarna, that also works across Apple. What this does is gives Apple more "price flexibility" (aka, th…

Citizens was the worst part of the prior program

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#199

Post by cloudfudge »

apparent wrote: post #197

Interestingly, Apple is apparently going to be able to nerf the devices if the customer misses a series of payments. [1] Presumably this ability means that Klarna has a lower risk of nonpayment, and is willing to accept a smaller cut of the total price from Apple. 1: https://9to5mac.com/2026/07/21/ios-27-code-suggests-apple-co...

Note that they already do this if you buy a mac on an Apple Card, and they even go so far as to link your AppleID that you may have had for decades. I bought a new mac last year and signed up for the 0% Apple Card financing and if I'd have known about this little bit of leverage they use, I would have created a brand new AppleID to partition it off.

Re: The iPhone Upgrade Program is being replaced by Apple Upgrade

#200

Post by trollbridge »

paxys wrote: post #65
nerdjon wrote: post #23

The math for the new program is kinda perplexing, my guess is that they are hoping that most people just will send in the device and upgrade. If I am reading the FAQ here properly: https://www.apple.com/shop/apple-upgrade . > If you decide to buy the device, the purchase option fee is the list price minus any lease payments you’ve made minus any remaining discounts or trade-in credit. (excluding tax and any damage fe…

> iPhone 17 pro max would be $1199 to buy (~1273 with tax) or $34.99 for 24 months totaling $839.76. So would cost 433.33 at the end of the lease to keep it A lot of people aren’t going to have that $433 at the end of the lease to purchase the device outright, and so will have to roll it into another 2-year monthly payment, and another one after that. So the goal of the program is the same as every other similar one…

Given how rapidly iPhones depreciate, being able to just give it back after 2 years is pretty reasonable. My 16 Pro Max is worth maybe $500 on the resale market.
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