7.1 Earthquake in Japan • Hacker News Board

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#181

Post by xp84 » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:25 PM UTC

kalleboo wrote: post #156

xp84 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but it imposes its own limitations as the previous poster pointed out. There is no 1:1 swap-out for cooking that doesn't require either changing out your cookware or settling for a frustrating and slow cooking experience. Also (this is a US perspective - perhaps Japan's labor costs are different?), running new heavy duty (240v, high-amperage) power cabling from the main breaker box to your kitchen is another hu…

Japan has a very different real estate market. Homes are typically built to order, you buy it on a 35 year loan and then live it until you die, then the next person buys the land, tears the house down and builds their own dream home to order. So houses depreciate like cars. Land only gains value in specific downtown areas since the country is depopulating. It's common to do a "full renovation" where the house is torn…

That is super cool. Unimaginable budget from a US perspective. I think in California I could struggle to stay under that $120k budget on just one kitchen renovation, and I don't mean a luxury kitchen with Viking appliances. Just the normal Home Depot grade stuff. If you added a single bathroom to the invoice there's no way it would stay under.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#182

Post by toast0 » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:28 PM UTC

saltcured wrote: post #175

toast0 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I live in the US (near Seattle), there's no piped natural gas, most detatched houses have a 250-500 gallon propane tank. Seattle has piped gas, but my county never had the density to justify the expense to install distribution piping and now its disfavored. My house has a second tank for a backup generator. We use the main tank for our stove/range, water heater, clothes dryer, and a decorative fireplace that's…

It's interesting all the permutations there are out there. We have gas from PG&E. Our house has an electric clothes dryer, gas stove with dual-fuel oven, gas furnace, and gas water heater. No air-conditioning other than a portable unit for "emergency" heatwave and AQI events. Our furnace is ancient, and the winter gas bill is the painful part. I have a long term interest in full electrification, but find the process…

Yep, when I was in the bay area, we had a gas furnace that was built in week 53 of the year before the 78% efficiency standard took effect. Our plan was to put in a heatpump to replace it when it stopped working and get A/C to manage (at least) the heatwaves, but it kept going, so you know. That house was built in 1907 and had an unfinished basement for the original footprint and a generous crawl space for the addition --- wiring would have been pretty simple, but it would still be a lot of investment to replace something that was working ... of course a heat pump system would be way more than replacing like for like.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#183

Post by qurren » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:31 PM UTC

account42 wrote: post #143

klausa wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is… literally the only surface that stoves in this form factor have?

This form factor is installed by literally cutting a whole into a flat surface, nothing limits you to only one hole.

If you're in an American home, you typically have one of the following 4 setups for a stove: (A) 36" range (B) 30" range (C) 36" countertop cutout (D) 30" countertop cutout. That's about >95% of US homes.

This company appears to be catering to markets (C) and (D), and would be a drop-in replacement for whatever other stovetop they currently have. Most likely it can be a DIY self-install with the exception of capping a prior gas line.

If you require the user to cut new holes in their fancy granite for your custom knobs, they lose the option of going back if they don't like it.

There are some extremely-high end cooktops (e.g. Gaggenau) do require the additional cutouts for controls, but they have already proven their brand with high-end users so they can pull that off. A startup can't.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#184

Post by lstodd » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:31 PM UTC

perching_aix wrote: post #166

lstodd wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I turn my old gorenje all out on four burners it'll output the likes of maybe 30kW give or take. The largest burner is I think about 15KW on full throttle and that does only acceptable wok or very smoky steak on cast iron ribbed pan. For a couple of years I had nothing but a 3.7kW inductions while I lived elsewhere. Two of them melted and warped from the heat to the point of breaking the top glass and forget about…

OK, Gorenje, gas stove, wok use: https://international.gorenje.com/products/cooking-and-bakin... The largest burner has an output of 3.5 kW (12K BTU). Did a general pass before sending my previous comment anyhow, found much the same across the board. What you say reliably checks out with the unit corrected to BTU on the gas side, but not otherwise. Are you sure you're not mixing BTU and watts? > If all you cook is ra…

What I have is from 2008 or so, I can't even find the exact model. I guess it's now politically incorrect to even list it.

Plus side: works as new, even the original thermal pair shutoffs were never swapped and that's basically the only thing that fails in them.

Soups i can see. Stews.. unless we completely misunderstand each other they're better done in the stove, inside. Not to mention baking some bread. With which an induction top will not help either. To be honest, baking and stewing imo depend more on thermal mass that brings very stable temperature, for which even gas ovens are meh, you're better off with true wood-fueled brick stove, or the result is not even close. One can maybe make an electrically-heated brick stove, but for some reason I haven't seen one. Maybe it's because it'll be slow as hell to heat up. And no authentic crunchy charcoal in your fresh pizza.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#185

Post by jakzurr » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:34 PM UTC

traceroute66 wrote: post #95

bombcar wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A hundred years from now people are going to be absolutely flabbergasted how we just piped gas everywhere all the time. Electricity allows for so many more automatic safeguards.

> Electricity allows for so many more automatic safeguards. Since the mid-2000s there has actually been a push by Japanese utility companies for adoption of what they call "all-electric" オール電化. Adoption has been reasonably good with new-builds because they can also have solar panels. But adoption in older properties has been slower. First in general, electricity in Japan has tended to be more expensive than gas. Seco…

At the plastics plant I worked at in the 2010's, they had seismic emergency valves for the natural gas. At the time, I thought they were such a pain, as the vibration caused by a semi-trailer bumping a warehouse dock could cause them to shut off. (But it only took a screwdriver and 2 minutes to reset the valve.)

Now I'm thinking such valves are a good measure. I have no idea if they could work in such a major quake, though - for example, if the gas line fractured farther back from the seismic cutoff valve?

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#186

Post by perching_aix » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:34 PM UTC

lstodd wrote: post #184

perching_aix wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, Gorenje, gas stove, wok use: https://international.gorenje.com/products/cooking-and-bakin... The largest burner has an output of 3.5 kW (12K BTU). Did a general pass before sending my previous comment anyhow, found much the same across the board. What you say reliably checks out with the unit corrected to BTU on the gas side, but not otherwise. Are you sure you're not mixing BTU and watts? > If all you cook is ra…

What I have is from 2008 or so, I can't even find the exact model. I guess it's now politically incorrect to even list it. Plus side: works as new, even the original thermal pair shutoffs were never swapped and that's basically the only thing that fails in them. Soups i can see. Stews.. unless we completely misunderstand each other they're better done in the stove, inside. Not to mention baking some bread. With which…

> What I have is from 2008 or so, I can't even find the exact model. I guess it's now politically incorrect to even list it.

I did check for older models as well. Even dug up some stove catalogues from the 70s and 80s to be extra sure. I just genuinely cannot confirm your numbers. I'm about as confident in my unit confusion hypothesis as I can reasonably be.

I'm sure you had the experiences you're recounting, but as far as the numbers go, they do not seem to explain them. Especially since these are the burner ratings, before the heat transfer losses.

If I do accept the unit confusion on your behalf:

15K BTU (your biggest gas burner) -> 55% efficiency (optimistic) -> 8250 BTU reaching the pan

3.6 kW (cheap plug-in induction stove) -> 80% efficiency (pessimistic) -> 10045 BTU reaching the pan

It just doesn't compute.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#187

Post by pseudosavant » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:34 PM UTC

kalleboo wrote: post #136

lstodd wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electrical is inadequate power delivery-wise and requires completely different cookware to the point that it's a different cuisine. For example to replicate a gas burner you have to have above 15KW continious power. Good luck wiring that into your apartment, or feeding this with local solar. Or even finding an induction stovetop that won't melt its insides in a year or two at a measly 5KW.

Gas has more raw power but it's extremely inefficient because most of it just escapes into the room, whereas with induction it all goes into the cookware. Our induction stove boils water way faster than our gas one did, and the gas one on full blast melted and ruined the handle on the pot since so much of the heat escapes around the sides. Technology Connections on YouTube has done videos on the topic, comparing elec…

Agreed. My current electric cooktop boils water faster than any gas cooktop I've ever had, and it isn't even induction. It produces so much less excess heat into the kitchen too. You can't stop the heat instantly like you can with gas, but in practice that has been a complete non-issue. Definitely my favorite cooktop.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#188

Post by ctime » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:41 PM UTC

traceroute66 wrote: post #95

bombcar wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A hundred years from now people are going to be absolutely flabbergasted how we just piped gas everywhere all the time. Electricity allows for so many more automatic safeguards.

> Electricity allows for so many more automatic safeguards. Since the mid-2000s there has actually been a push by Japanese utility companies for adoption of what they call "all-electric" オール電化. Adoption has been reasonably good with new-builds because they can also have solar panels. But adoption in older properties has been slower. First in general, electricity in Japan has tended to be more expensive than gas. Seco…

“People used to cooking with gas, cook better with gas”

Induction offers the benefits of not emitting noxious fumes, the dangers of transporting gas over long distances in bulk, the fire hazards inside the home, and dependency on single source energy.

Electricity, via induction cooktops, is often faster, more energy efficient, safer for everyone, and doesn’t depend on whatever regime or state wants to play games with the supply. Where I live, electricity is often sold at negative rates for most of the day and that electricity is now going into batteries at a massive scale. It seems unlikely gas has any future, outside of niche cooking or industrial/commercial uses.

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#189

Post by Marsymars » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:41 PM UTC

bombcar wrote: post #176

UltraSane wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The one place gas makes sense is heating in cold climates because furnaces are externally vented.

Modern ones are well done, but old chimney based ones are a notorious problem. Cooking is really the only thing where gas has real (e.g., not cost) advantages. Nobody says “this hot water just doesn’t feel right, I like it boiled by dragon’s breath”. But a steak burned with gas is different than one burned with hot electric.

If you have the space/configuration for it, a really nice setup is an induction stove in the house, and then a gas-powered BBQ, so then you can cook outside for things that really call for gas. (Without any effect on your indoor air quality.)

Re: 7.1 Earthquake in Japan

#190

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jul 28, 2026, 5:42 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #109

bombcar wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A hundred years from now people are going to be absolutely flabbergasted how we just piped gas everywhere all the time. Electricity allows for so many more automatic safeguards.

Replicating the power density of a gas pipe requires far more than 110v ac. The future might wonder why we accepted the danger of 5,000v power lines running through food courts just to avoid using gas burners.

[deleted]