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DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

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Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The primary purpose of DMARC is to prevent impersonation not to prevent spam. I own a domain, I implement DMARC to make sure others know when email from my domain is legitimately from my domain.

Isn't that the purpose of DKIM and SPF already?

DKIM and SPF validate a message. DMARC sets a policy as to what to do with it (quarantine/reject.)

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The primary purpose of DMARC is to prevent impersonation not to prevent spam. I own a domain, I implement DMARC to make sure others know when email from my domain is legitimately from my domain.

Isn't that the purpose of DKIM and SPF already?

Yes and no. DKIM signs part of the envelope to help recipients detect alteration (by verifying authenticity), SPF locks down the permissible origins for the sender. SPF is in itself imperfect and can in some situations be exploited on open-access shared systems. If the two are used in concert they offer decent protection.

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#84

Email has been turned into a by-the-corporation, for-the-corporation service. Corporations need DMARC so they can control email and the ability to spam. The spam I cannot block is spam from Google. If you decide to think about this, you will quickly realize that email is f*ked and needs to be forked. Perhaps we need a Community Email Initiative that blocks corporations and only allows Community members. Trust is the…

What do you mean “fork”? Just buy a domain and install an email server.

Buy a domain? If you're going to fork email, may as well go the whole hog and fork DNS too!

Have your own gmail.com

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that the purpose of DKIM and SPF already?

Yes and no. DKIM signs part of the envelope to help recipients detect alteration (by verifying authenticity), SPF locks down the permissible origins for the sender. SPF is in itself imperfect and can in some situations be exploited on open-access shared systems. If the two are used in concert they offer decent protection.

Using both has to be done very carefully, because a positive result from the weaker one (SPF) will override a negative result from the stronger one (DKIM). You should maximally use DKIM and minimally use SPF. Ideally, you should not use SPF at all, but there are some senders that still don't support DKIM.

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that the purpose of DKIM and SPF already?

Yes and no. DKIM signs part of the envelope to help recipients detect alteration (by verifying authenticity), SPF locks down the permissible origins for the sender. SPF is in itself imperfect and can in some situations be exploited on open-access shared systems. If the two are used in concert they offer decent protection.

This is true, and yet DMARC v1 does not require you to use them in concert. Either one (a valid DKIM-signed message with sender alignment or a message that passes SPF checks with sender alignment) is enough to pass DMARC.

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because if someone spoofs an email coming from your domain DMARC tells the receiver what to do with the spoofed email.

And SPF doesn't?

No, it doesn't.

In the following SMTP conversation:

  MAIL FROM: foo@example.net
  RCPT TO: victim@example.com
  DATA
  From: service@paypal.co.uk
  To: victim@example.com
  Subject: We are updating our Terms of Service
  [...]
SPF checks whether the sending host is allowed to send e-mail from example.net (the envelope sender).

The recipient sees service@paypal.co.uk (the From address on the inner message), because most ESPs do them the great disservice of not indicating that the sender identities are not aligned.

Adding a DMARC record to a domain requires that e-mail whose inner messages claim to be from that domain must have sender alignment to the envelope sender.

The above message would pass SPF (if the spammer owns example.net and has created SPF records for themselves) but would fail DMARC (paypal.co.uk's DMARC record exists, so alignment is required, and yet example.net != paypal.co.uk, so they are not aligned). In this case their DMARC policy says to reject the message, so (if the recipient is checking DMARC) it would either be rejected outright or it would land in Spam/Quarantine rather than Inbox.

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not familiar with Outlook's resending, but the use case is supported if the sender uses DKIM. If the email is forwarded without changing any details, it can keep the DKIM signature. That allows the forwarded email to still pass DMARC. Now if the sender used SPF + DMARC but not DKIM, this does not work, since the sender IP can't be verified with the forwarded email. In that case, the forwarder has to change the fr…

I have a long-standing email address that forwards to an email system that I run. The operator of the forwarder switched to using Microsoft's mail infrastructure some years ago and the quality of service of the forward has degraded dramatically ever since. I've often seen messages resent by Microsoft's mail infrastructure with gratuitously broken DKIM signatures, generally due to changes to whitespace that are not an…

I never understood the point of the anti-virus adding a message to _outgoing_ emails. Basically "I swear there is no virus in this email I'm sending you, trust me bro".

Re: DMARC has been public since 2012 but most company domains still don't enforce it

#90
post #28

Sadly the article doesn't really touch on whether or not DMARC accomplishes anything truly useful. When I enabled DMARC for ingress email on one of my own mail servers, it ultimately ended up regularly blocking a handful emails from customers, yet virtually all the spam coming in had valid SPF / DKIM / DMARC, as do most of the phishing attacks. The core problem is that the real need of email end users need is a way o…

> virtually all the spam coming in had valid SPF / DKIM / DMARC, as do most of the phishing attacks. This should create a means to go after the domain owners via registrar and trail of ownership, even so far as blocking email from the domain. Forcing the spammers to pass DMARC creates a burden and an evidence trail that didn't exist before.

Can we use DMARC to ask Gmail to close registrations? Google Calendar to allow far fewer people the ability to send invite notifications? Firebase to close registrations? Azure? Microsoft 365? AWS SES?

It feels like the biggest spammers have swung back to just abusing SaaS and getting SPF / DKIM / DMARC for free from one of the big email providers.

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