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Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

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Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#111
post #25
post #6

It's quite important that SERPs are scrapeable, because they keep advertising scams like ETA/ESTA sites: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-56886957

It's interesting to imagine how the world would be different, if internet advertising giants were partially liable for scams/malware that they facilitate.

Presumably they would only have to show they're doing some simple due diligence. At minimum KYC and a reporting process that works. Neither of which Google et el do currently.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#112
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's interesting to imagine how the world would be different, if internet advertising giants were partially liable for scams/malware that they facilitate.

Ironically it's only really people who heavily ad-block/privacy-protect that get these scam/malware ads. When Google has no profile on you, your view is virtually worthless, so it's only bottom feeders that bid on those views. Average users get Coke and Tide ads. Its usually the most technically adept that get the worst ads, and usually they just turn their ad block back on.

If I wasn't blocking ads this is what I would normally be seeing.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#113
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't the giants closer to the mob than a police force? I suppose those things are not terribly different in practice, but Google, Facebook, et al make money from leaving the scams on their ad networks.

Either way works - I'd still prefer the scammers to be liable and persecuted for their scamming than demanding that platforms enact censorship and policeing control.

The platform:

1. Takes money from the scammer

2. Tells the scammer how to target people

3. Serves the scam to the consumer, ensuring they see it

4. Takes a cut of the action when the scam is successful

5. Tells the scammer how to optimize their campaign

6. Continues working with scammers after they're reported

The scammer has a fairly small part in the overall operation. The platform is doing almost all of the actual work perpetrating the scam. They're not remotely innocent here.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, go ahead and ask the LLM who won the 2026 World Cup. Or nearby BBQ places open now. Even assuming no hallucinations, an LLM can replace some use cases for search but not all.

I tried both and it’s not even close which interface is better when it comes to answering a question. Google gives you stuff to sift through and interpret. AI just gives the answer. Imagine you’re in the car or hands free or disabled and you just want the question answered. https://ibb.co/whYmZWxs https://ibb.co/JFkQbmJf

Do you have a free or paid ChatGPT license?

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#115
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't the giants closer to the mob than a police force? I suppose those things are not terribly different in practice, but Google, Facebook, et al make money from leaving the scams on their ad networks.

Either way works - I'd still prefer the scammers to be liable and persecuted for their scamming than demanding that platforms enact censorship and policeing control.

Normally, if there is sufficient evidence, both the mob boss and the ground level gangster are liable and criminally responsible for their crimes. You are free to disagree, but I don't see any reason why big tech companies should be completely immune from any and all responsibility for facilitating and taking a cut of the criminal activity taken on their territory.

You are also free to call it censorship, but I am not aware of any jurisdiction where fraud is considered protected speech, so as far as I'm concerned, censor away baby.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#116

“You are trying to kidnap what I have rightfully stolen, and I think it quite ungentlemanly."

Google crawling respects robots.txt and doesn't break capcha. It is easy to tell Google to piss off. SerpAPI fully relies on end-user proxies distributed like malware (in LG tv apps for instance), it has no other way it could function because it exclusively ingests data from sources that tell it to stop. If you wanted to scrape a bot friendly site, you wouldn't need SerpApi

The question I have that no one has really answered is...what kind of crawling have the current frontier labs done historically and what are they continuing to do now for training? Inference can follow rules easily, but the training is a big black box that mostly gets headlines for books getting slashed but that's not the only source of data is it?

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#117
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried both and it’s not even close which interface is better when it comes to answering a question. Google gives you stuff to sift through and interpret. AI just gives the answer. Imagine you’re in the car or hands free or disabled and you just want the question answered. https://ibb.co/whYmZWxs https://ibb.co/JFkQbmJf

Do you have a free or paid ChatGPT license?

Free Claude.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#118
post #58

I'd be more OK with this if Google had a good API for their search results. But they've deprecated it, and now there is no alternative. So I'll continue to use 3rd parties that scrape Google results, until they change their mind.

I wonder how this changes things (EU forces to share search data): https://abcnews.com/Technology/wireStory/eu-forces-google-sh...

Easy workaround for Google: charge a non token non symbolic amount for Google Search.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I stopped using Google once it started requiring JS for search. That was the day the open web truly died.

EMCAScript has an open standard that anyone can implement.

But it shouldn't be necessary, nor is "can" any reasonable defense. The same goes for the BS about "open standard" web that is actually just Google-controlled and churning constantly to anticompetitively maintain their monopoly.

Re: Judge Rejects Google's Attempt to DMCA Its Way Out of Being Scraped

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically it's only really people who heavily ad-block/privacy-protect that get these scam/malware ads. When Google has no profile on you, your view is virtually worthless, so it's only bottom feeders that bid on those views. Average users get Coke and Tide ads. Its usually the most technically adept that get the worst ads, and usually they just turn their ad block back on.

From where did you come to conclusion that adblock users get malware ads? This is the first time I am hearing this thing.

They aren't, because they are blocking ads.

But when they turn off ad-block, to "see what it's like", they are not getting an accurate view. It's usually all crypto and other scammy/vices type ads.

Go look at your mom's browser. Her Google ads are going to be clothes, tissues, and cookware.

Nigerian prince scams cannot outbid Kleenex without breaking the economics of the scam. But they can get loaded when Kleenex no-bids because they don't know who the viewer is.

Trust me, ad-tech is far far beyond 2004 when ad block showed up.

(I'll add that of course there are other less legitimate ad networks, and I'm not counting "snake oil" products, which are essentially scams but customers still swear by them)

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