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The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

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Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Retractable awnings are very common including in residential setups in southern Europe.

Do those also cover the apartment walls? I've only seen large awnings covering walls in detached houses, and even then it's relatively rare to cover walls that aren't close to doors.

Usually no, most of the times the walls that have the longest sun exposure have terraces/balconies and awnings.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Moralistic arguments that using air conditioning is harmful to society Can you name one? That isn't the same argument as against all needless waste? What I'm seeing is we can't even talk about shutter designs without talking about AC instead. Using AC may not harm society, but some people knowing about it kinda does.

The moralistic argument here in France is that the AC units heat the outside air, which worsens things for people outside, especially those who can't afford AC in their home. Never mind that these same people would go absolutely out of their minds if you suggested tearing down and remodeling most cities, which are basically radiators at night since there's concrete everywhere. So instead of trying to somehow mitigate…

> so now electricity consumption is even higher

Which is not great because it's wasteful, so you're making the same "moralistic argument". Unless your point is just that it's hypocritical, of course.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#73
post #26
post #2

While all of these might offer some cooling in your home, nothing beats air conditioning.

I've put some fabric on the outside of my windows using nylon thread, a stapler and some plastic suction cups. It made the day time temperature of my living room go from about 32°C to about 23°C during a heatwave in the UK. I won't need aircon in that room now. I do have an upstairs office that will keep on getting hot, so I might get an aircon there in a year or two. But I'm not desperate thanks to a tiny bit of eff…

Suction cups and nylon thread is exactly the solution I need to hang my blackout material. Hadn't thought of that. Thanks!

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#74
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But there is no airflow inbetween the outside and the building core - the panels are still part of the building itself.

https://steelroofsheets.co.uk/categories/ventilated-wall-cla...

The key point I'm trying to make is that the shade structure or outer shell should be separated by at least 50cm, and in such a way that even the slightest breeze moves air though it.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#75
post #73
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've put some fabric on the outside of my windows using nylon thread, a stapler and some plastic suction cups. It made the day time temperature of my living room go from about 32°C to about 23°C during a heatwave in the UK. I won't need aircon in that room now. I do have an upstairs office that will keep on getting hot, so I might get an aircon there in a year or two. But I'm not desperate thanks to a tiny bit of eff…

Suction cups and nylon thread is exactly the solution I need to hang my blackout material. Hadn't thought of that. Thanks!

My next version will have two hooks using those space age double sided sticky tape strips, and the fabric will be held together by a thin pvc frame with two hooks at the top, so I can hang it from the ground without using a step ladder.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#76

All these assume that the ambient temperature outside will be lower than the temperature in your home, hence you want the air to come in but keep the sun out. In southern Europe this is false for many weeks during the summer. During heatwaves you want to open all the windows during the night, and close everything at 9ish-10. Because the temperature outside is going to rise to 40-45 celsius the ambient air will only h…

nice of you to think that by evening you get cooler air :D we have had days where the only time of the day where the outside temp was lower than indoor's was between 01-07. So either you stay up to open the windows, or wait till early morning... but then you just get 1-2 hrs before having to close everything again

In addition, in some places (where I live) the air quality is extremely poor for much of the summer due to wildfire smoke. So even if you do get a cool night, if you don't have AC you have to choose between maintaining some level of air quality indoors or cooling your house.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The moralistic argument here in France is that the AC units heat the outside air, which worsens things for people outside, especially those who can't afford AC in their home. Never mind that these same people would go absolutely out of their minds if you suggested tearing down and remodeling most cities, which are basically radiators at night since there's concrete everywhere. So instead of trying to somehow mitigate…

> so now electricity consumption is even higher Which is not great because it's wasteful, so you're making the same "moralistic argument". Unless your point is just that it's hypocritical, of course.

I'm not sure I'd say it's hypocritical. More like unintended consequences?

Part of the moralistic argument against planned AC rollout is electricity consumption. But not doing it is actually generating more consumption in practice.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#78
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In southern Europe this is false for many weeks during the summer. This is also now often false in non-southern Europe as well. Apparently one of the reasons why French don't have air conditioning is because nights tended to be cool in the past, and so people left windows and doors open while sleeping creating drafts and letting the masonry cool. But in the last ~15 years nights have been as hot as days at times, a…

"So the all-the-AC-all-the-time thinking of the US may be excessive," Unfortunately, there are many areas of the US where humidity is the real reason for running the AC so much. In places like the Mid-Atlantic states you might get a month or so in spring and fall where you mostly don't need AC or heat. Once summer actually hits, it seems rare to have a day where it's under 85F and under 70% humidity. The south is eve…

> Unfortunately, there are many areas of the US where humidity is the real reason for running the AC so much.

* https://www.santa-fe-products.com/product-category/dehumidif...

* https://www.aprilaire.com/whole-house-products/dehumidifiers

I happen to live in one of those areas:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto#Climate

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humid_continental_climate

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#79
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://steelroofsheets.co.uk/categories/ventilated-wall-cla...

The key point I'm trying to make is that the shade structure or outer shell should be separated by at least 50cm, and in such a way that even the slightest breeze moves air though it.

Yeah I think that’s done. Tragically this technique coupled with a poor selection of materials was the structural cause of the grenfell fire. We see this kind of panelling around various European cities. “Cladding” it is called and it serves a few different purposes with regards to thermal management.

Re: The old-school way of keeping the summer heat out of your home

#80
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In southern Europe this is false for many weeks during the summer. This is also now often false in non-southern Europe as well. Apparently one of the reasons why French don't have air conditioning is because nights tended to be cool in the past, and so people left windows and doors open while sleeping creating drafts and letting the masonry cool. But in the last ~15 years nights have been as hot as days at times, a…

"So the all-the-AC-all-the-time thinking of the US may be excessive," Unfortunately, there are many areas of the US where humidity is the real reason for running the AC so much. In places like the Mid-Atlantic states you might get a month or so in spring and fall where you mostly don't need AC or heat. Once summer actually hits, it seems rare to have a day where it's under 85F and under 70% humidity. The south is eve…

Fun fact, air conditioning was invented for lowering humidity in warehouses, hence why it is called air conditioning and not air cooling.
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