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EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

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Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#51

Post by brador »

esterna wrote: post #37
phiresky wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU told them they can not by default prefer their own maps product when linking from their search product, they have to allow the user to choose. They could have simply added a selector when a user first clicks on the maps preview in the search result, and then remembered it on device or across that user's account. But of course, then the user could choose a competitor's product and Google would have to honor it.…

I wonder if the EU will someday figure out a patch for this "Deteriorate everyone's user experience in a way that is technically compliant and blame the EU" behavioural exploit...

The corrective force should be market competition, but Google is a monopoly not a monopoly with so many moats it might as well be a monopoly.

They also buy up the competition before it gets a chance as is the way now.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#52

Post by nolok »

darkwater wrote: post #48
nolok wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's malicious compliance with the intent of having the users misunderstand what's happening (that you don't have to do that but do it on purpose, and instead blame the law protecting them). And eh, it works for the cookie banner so why change the strategy ? The comment you're answering to prove it still works. As long as people can't be bothered to think and inform themselves for a second about it, they won't stop.…

Yes, but by the time you are sued and fined into compliance again, you already made a ton of money to pay 10x the next fine.

Yes and no, it's true now but the EU fines are not just "you did that" but "you did that we're going to assume you're going to be better and if you do again next time it will really hurt". Which I think is a fair point of view.

You might still answer too little to late, but given that we're at the starting point to a massive sovereignty push here thanks to the current US admin being proved as a possibility rather than a novelty, I think this matters a lot.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#53

Post by nolok »

esterna wrote: post #37
phiresky wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU told them they can not by default prefer their own maps product when linking from their search product, they have to allow the user to choose. They could have simply added a selector when a user first clicks on the maps preview in the search result, and then remembered it on device or across that user's account. But of course, then the user could choose a competitor's product and Google would have to honor it.…

I wonder if the EU will someday figure out a patch for this "Deteriorate everyone's user experience in a way that is technically compliant and blame the EU" behavioural exploit...

It's fine + obligation to fix, and daily fine until fixed, and higher fine if you do it again.

I know that sounds like it comes from "it will never work", but that's how active directory, office file format, etc ... got opened, and in a case more similar to here that's how windows n and decoupling of media and internet component from windows internals happened.

The issue is, yes, it takes time.

Another issue, purely PR, is that yes the EU gets attacked repeatedly by people trying to match "respect the law of the market or leave" with "the EU tax US companies because they can't compete".

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#54

Post by trolleski »

83642736392 wrote: post #36
trolleski wrote: post #30

Don't worry, EU will give it back in almost every gov running on the American BigTech, it's just a show. The Granny In Chief has to get the emails somehow. /s

[flagged]

I own nothing and am happy, am happy! Do not, I repeat do not send a senile agent my way, I can't stand listening to the Cold War stories anymore...

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#55

Post by maccard »

nolok wrote: post #29
phiresky wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU told them they can not by default prefer their own maps product when linking from their search product, they have to allow the user to choose. They could have simply added a selector when a user first clicks on the maps preview in the search result, and then remembered it on device or across that user's account. But of course, then the user could choose a competitor's product and Google would have to honor it.…

It's malicious compliance with the intent of having the users misunderstand what's happening (that you don't have to do that but do it on purpose, and instead blame the law protecting them). And eh, it works for the cookie banner so why change the strategy ? The comment you're answering to prove it still works. As long as people can't be bothered to think and inform themselves for a second about it, they won't stop.…

Well no, the cookie banner is a well intentioned but flawed and poorly designed law. Any law that is that technically specific but relies on people without an understanding of how it works is doomed to repeat the same fate. The eu should have seen prop 65 and not sleepwalked back into it.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#56

Post by master-lincoln »

geokon wrote: post #40
plantain wrote: post #10

It drives me insane when in Europe the link between Google Search and Google Maps is broken and I often have to copy paste an address between the two. Thanks EU, what if I like Google's integrations?

I think this is a larger web-standards problem. There is no standard clickable "link" for physical locations. There is no URL-equivalent you can send to someone, they click it, it open up their map viewer of choice. You can send Lat Lon coordinates and then have the recipient copy and paste them. It generally works though there isn't a standard format and no service will make it clickable like an email address, so th…

There is a standard: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geo_URI_scheme

I have it working on my Android phone. It's clickable links that open my map app of choice (or rather a selection dialog).

It's just that the big players do not want to use it.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#57

Post by elric »

JFC these comments.

It should be clear to everyone that Google is too big and is engaging in anti-competitive behaviour. The EU giving them a token fine every once in a while is just part of the cost of doing business for Google. Google could just choose to not favour their own services and to give users a choice. But they don't. Hence the fine.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#58

Post by vrganj »

qq66 wrote: post #5

The EU has found a clever way to charge US tech companies for market access without triggering a WTO violation.

Look, US tech services can either follow our laws our they can get the fuck out of our market.

The way people treat them breaking our laws as their god given right and then frame our fine as anything but their own fault is starting to really annoy me.

Respect our sovereignty, follow our laws. Or don't, but then don't be surprised that breaking the law is punished.

Maybe things are different in the US, maybe corporate capture has progressed to a point where laws are optional for megacorps. But we still have rule of law and we'd like to keep it that way.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#59

Post by tchalla »

maccard wrote: post #55
nolok wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's malicious compliance with the intent of having the users misunderstand what's happening (that you don't have to do that but do it on purpose, and instead blame the law protecting them). And eh, it works for the cookie banner so why change the strategy ? The comment you're answering to prove it still works. As long as people can't be bothered to think and inform themselves for a second about it, they won't stop.…

Well no, the cookie banner is a well intentioned but flawed and poorly designed law. Any law that is that technically specific but relies on people without an understanding of how it works is doomed to repeat the same fate. The eu should have seen prop 65 and not sleepwalked back into it.

There a reason why we have courts. Laws aren’t algorithms despite what the tech world wet dream might want them to be.

Re: EU Fines Google $1.02B for Favoring Its Own Services

#60

Post by mrtksn »

f6v wrote: post #45
mrtksn wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share the frustration but maybe if Google hadn't gained a monopoly status Google Maps wouldn’t have been in its current sorry state. My assessment is that EU is doing too little too late, the fine should have been something like 20B and used towards creating a non-profit, open and extendable map service ideally with the people who already do great mapping tech that don't show up in Google search results at the top.…

> if Google hadn't gained a monopoly status Google Maps wouldn’t have been in its current sorry state What's up with Google Maps? It's great for me.

On mobile its navigation is terrible, takes you into strange routes that might be technically faster but are hard to drive at or sometimes non-existent. Sometimes tries to be smart, makes everything worse. i.e. suggest a route that it says its 5 min faster and shows no traffic and you find out that there's no traffic because of a road closure further ahead. The UI when driving is not as good as the competition. I only use it because it has superior business listings with decent reviews and photos.

On desktop the web app is jittery, occasional freezing of UI, buttons stop working(most often the street view figure just doesn't show the available street view or would refuse being dropped at a location). Textures wouldn't load, sometimes will downgrade the UI to non-webgl version.

Also, businesses are often frustrated when it comes to changing their address, no proper support exists to fix mistakes or do updates.

I would loved if EU forced Google to open its maps business data for a year for download so competing services can achieve parity in this regard. After all, Google has this data because its a monopoly - people simply uploaded their photos and reviews to Google Maps because most people use it because Google forced it down the throat of everybody.

Ah, also Google is pretty evil when it comes to maps. They jacked up the API prices to ridiculous levels once the become the absolute dominant service and they also tried to make iPhone undesirable by not making their Google Maps app in some countries when Apple screwed up with Apple maps and Apple maps was practically useless outside the US.

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