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Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

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Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#171

Post by dgellow »

SecretDreams wrote: post #63
miohtama wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SpaceX, like Tesla, has always been about Elon Musk. Investors are buying Musk, like they were buying Warren Buffett with Berkshire Hathaway. Long-term shareholders are not buying space; they are buying Musk. This has been clear to everyone since the beginning; it has been well communicated (look at SpaceX governance rules in Texas), and there is nothing mystical about it. It's very likely Musk will roll everything u…

Investors are buying into the fallacy that musk can continue to work as a hype man, rather than some visionary or innovator. They like that he can make stock numbers go up, seemingly against all odds and reason. Whether this trend continues or not indefinitely will largely determine if incestors start looking for the door.

It's really sad to see that we just accept that Elon Musk, one of the most influential and maybe-still-the richest person in the world is constantly lying to shareholders for his own benefit. And gets zero punishment for it.

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#172

Post by elif »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #140
trimbo wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think companies expanding their business should be the only reason to sell. Apple was a desktop and laptop computer company when they released the iPod. Nokia was a company making rubber products when they started making cellular equipment in the 1970s. Amazon was a ecomm company when they released AWS. Etc. Sure, I'm cherrypicking the success stories but I don't think it's the only signal people should use.

Companies laundering their CEO's other failing companies is certainly a reason to sell.

$8.7B in losses over the last 5 quarters sounds bad, but that is also with $20.4B capital expenditure in the period and double digit percent increases per quarter in user metrics.

By traditional business metrics it looks toxic but compared to a typical tech unicorn it's not really outstanding.

Considering it's a tech unicorn with strategic and financial leverage like no other (their own global Internet infrastructure, access to arbitrary billions in capital, ability to build the biggest chip fab in the world), it's certainly fair to call it a gamble, but to call it failing is a stretch imo.

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#174

Post by miohtama »

dgellow wrote: post #162
jdross wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These have become some of the most valuable companies on Earth. The idea that there are lapses in governance in these companies is insane. Any shareholder is buying in fully aware of the governance structure. Many because of it! Shareholders’ rights are clearly enumerated.

In the case of Spacex that's literally not the case, when private investors bought shares the company was already a decade old and had a single class of shares. It's only since the IPO that the company switched to a dual structure, multiple years after private investors bought in. And class-B shares have only been given to Elon and a few of his friends.

The private investors were free to sue or arbitrage, as it is a private matter.

There were disputes around SpaceX secondary market/special purpose vehicle shares before the listing, but they were all settled out of court, AFAIK.

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#175

Post by andxor »

nonethewiser wrote: post #123
wenbin wrote: post #110

Alphabet is the modern day berkshire hathaway. Alphabet’s investment holdings (eg, spacex, anthropic..) are worth in the same order of magnitude of BRK’s (~$300B) The track record of google’s M&A is pretty good. Except for search and cloud, many of Google’s important products were from M&A - Maps, Docs, android, doubleclick, youtube , deep mind, etc.

How is Alphabet the modern Berkshire Hathaway?

Google's return of invested capital has averaged 32% since IPO.

This may be a narrative violation on HN, but the quality of Google's management is exceptional.

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#176

Post by elif »

dopa42365 wrote: post #116
mrits wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where did you get $15 billion from?

Or $150 billion SpaceX? Internet constellations may be mildly profitable, but beyond that, most things are an endless money pit without clear path towards profit anytime soon. Like, no one is going to spend a trillion on a moon base (or exponentially more for mars) without plans to somehow recover all that money.

The US government is the one who routinely spends trillions with no plans to recover money.

And SpaceX has become their favorite place to put money over the last 5 years.

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#177

Post by consensus1 »

browningstreet wrote: post #144
trimbo wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think companies expanding their business should be the only reason to sell. Apple was a desktop and laptop computer company when they released the iPod. Nokia was a company making rubber products when they started making cellular equipment in the 1970s. Amazon was a ecomm company when they released AWS. Etc. Sure, I'm cherrypicking the success stories but I don't think it's the only signal people should use.

SpaceX had adult leadership for a long time. I suspect there was a tacit agreement with Musk about a bit of separation. He broke through that professional firewall when he merged xAI with SpaceX and then pushed it to go public as he did. I also posit that Gwynne Shotwell is weirdly undervalued for what she's accomplished and what she's put up with, and I think that will show up some time in the future. There was enou…

Have you got any evidence for these claims?

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#179

Post by consensus1 »

mrits wrote: post #97
mhitza wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Love the typo. I think Musk's luck is running out, he's been too political this past year and he seems to also have run out of geek "street cred". Remember youtubers visiting (whatever the Tesla trade show was called) were more perplexed than impressed with what has been shown. Similar sentiment seen across trade shows (like CES) where everything was AI and no one seemed to ask themselves "why are we putting AI in th…

It’s so weird to see people actively try to criticize arguably the most successful person in the history of Earth.

Envy is a hell of a drug

Re: Google Discloses $94.1B in SpaceX Stock, Marking 6% Stake

#180

Post by cinntaile »

elif wrote: post #172
paulryanrogers wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Companies laundering their CEO's other failing companies is certainly a reason to sell.

$8.7B in losses over the last 5 quarters sounds bad, but that is also with $20.4B capital expenditure in the period and double digit percent increases per quarter in user metrics. By traditional business metrics it looks toxic but compared to a typical tech unicorn it's not really outstanding. Considering it's a tech unicorn with strategic and financial leverage like no other (their own global Internet infrastructure…

Did I miss something? When did Spacex get into the fab business?
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