I migrated off Patreon awhile back. It's extremely clunky, and the service charge is pretty high comparatively.
Patreon laying off 20% of staff
211–220 of 293 posts
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
Elon cut 80% of twitter staff and...well it's still there. Every tech CEO was watching that closely, and it didn't come out in the workers favor.
Twitter is nothing like it used to be.
Yea Twitter is a terrible example. It’s not even a shell of what it used to be.
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
The paradox can be resolved by assuming they are fallible and limited human beings - they're laying a bunch of people off, they understand at some level that this is evidence that their poor hiring and management decisions have caused some amount of unnecessary suffering, so they feel bad. But they aren't foresighted enough to have handled the situation appropriately in advance . Or they might have run into the limit…
Is it? Another is that modern society has created a system where advancing to the top ranks of corporate and political leadership requires mediocrity, and excellence is actively discouraged past a certain level of authority. The mediocre have just enough capability to do something right, but little enough that they're constantly surpassed by their more talented peers and never feel safe. So they go into "soft skills"…
> So they go into "soft skills" that their more talented peers aren't interested in, and sandbag themselves with authority once they get it.
Maybe their more talented peers should learn some of these soft skills and take an interest in authority positions instead of acting like losers? Is there some smart-person conspiracy to put idiots in charge that nobody has clued me in to?
I don't want to be going too far in telling my talented peers their business, but if capable people aren't interested in doing anything to take a leadership position then the leadership is going to be incapable by definition.
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#214[deleted]
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think what you’re describing is only a fraction of leaders and possibly a small minority of them. This concept is especially not applicable to profitable companies who have layoffs anyway. Hyper-optimization and AI adoption isn’t actually a business requirement if your business is making a profit. Plenty of businesses refuse to play that game and still make themselves a good living. Founders who want to claim emoti…
The profit by itself does not tell the whole story. There are loan repayments, investments and possibly other financial deals. > Founders who want to claim emotional connection to their employees should think about things like converting the company to full employee ownership In a previous (very small) company I worked we have tried something similar that and, guess what, some people refused. They just preferred mark…
Just as most organizations beyond a certain size will have a few people who reach a plateau where they are content and do not want any more responsibilities or pay. They don't want a new title, they don't want more prestige, they don't even want a raise. They just want to do what they do.
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#216The rich get richer and the poor get more AI edited and toned condolence posting.
I still don't understand the economics of the full AI rollout. Who the hell is buying anything if more than 50% of the workforce is unemployed? And among the post-AI employable, every job that isn't highly skilled is going to have the wages pushed to the floor due to rampant unemployment. None of this shit works unless we figure out "Star Trek welfare"...
in the short term, ai has been job-creating and unemployment remains quite low. The technology has mostly been augmentative (like every other technological revolution beforehand)
if (big if) the technology continues to improve at the current rapid pace, then we would need to organize welfare for the bottom % of population that cannot compete with ai or robotics in any feasible way, but that kind of presupposes insane productivity growth such that living off 'welfare' is a life of luxury compared to the average life right now
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
>instead of actively running the business. I’d like to be convinced of this point.
What about your CEO actively spending their time pursuing their own creative interests and doing speaking gigs railing against AI? And posting them on the company YT and his own YT just a week before somberly announcing layoffs where you cite AI as part of the reason... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17_HcR95YBc To be fair, tech companies I've worked at that have done layoffs have had seemingly full-time CEOs. So I…
Patreon entered my brain again recently only because Jack went to talk to The Verge on a podcast (text: https://www.theverge.com/podcast/952607/patreon-ceo-jack-con...). If you write a book or star in a film, you try to appear on every late night show there still is, etc. He’s trying hard to be relevant and position his company as good guys.
Now the rail against AI while laying off due to AI… would be quite ironic, but he seems more anti-theft while still excited about the tech. (Like me, theft is bad and open-source tech is neat.)
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why a company has to survive but not its people? For example when it comes to the IRS bill, the company will literally cease operations and sell all of its assets to pay IRS. Why the employees do not deserve this?
> Why a company has to survive but not its people? If the company collapses, those people lose their jobs anyway? > Why the employees do not deserve this? It's not about what employees "deserve," it's about the simple fact that the law allows the tax authorities to wind up a business to cover the tax bill. See the UK, where HMRC wound up Rangers FC ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administration_and_liquidation... ).
Exactly. With stroke of a pen a company is less important than its ability to pay taxes.
So we can put people above companies. With a stroke of a pen.
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
Apparently this is an unpopular opinion on HN, but a job isn't an output that companies produce, it's an agreement to compensate an employee in exchange for services, and just as the CEO shouldn't take it personally when one leaves to go work elsewhere, nobody needs to act like it's some kind of invidious social contract violation when the company no longer needs some of those services. In other words: resignation an…
I think depends on the culture/country. In the US definitely the agreements are more flexible. In Europe (and probably elsewhere) I feel that the expectation was (at least some years ago) that once you join a company the relation is stronger. Each variation has pluses and minuses, for companies and individuals.
Humans are tribal creatures, and joining a company and working with the same people every day creates bonds, a feeling of loyalty, and feelings of betrayal and unease when told they no longer belong.
Re: Patreon laying off 20% of staff
#220The only possible positive thing out of this cringy article is that the severance is decent (for a US company). 4 months of pay and healthcare coverage through Year end. Everything else could have just been a couple of sentences. Companies need to stop doing this melodrama every time they decide to fire people. Everyone knows the goal is to make money and keep a company profitable for their shareholders. Why these me…
It’s because, and I say this as a person who has made these calls, some leaders do feel a genuine responsibility for the people that work for them. Perhaps too, the ones that don’t, want people to think that they do. But as a founder and CEO by far the most emotionally taxing thing I have ever had to do is cut staff for the good of the company. You want to treat people the way you would want to be treated if you were…
Why is AI enabled right sizing inevitable for companies that are profitable but not seeing explosive growth?