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DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

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Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#61

Post by stackskipton »

bloqs wrote: post #60
whartung wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it, they done this in simulation, and the human pilots did not fare well. I don't know of the computer aircraft were able to fly beyond human limits (i.e. they don't black out) or not. If the computers can actually fly to what the airframe is capable of, they would have a distinct advantage over the human pilots.

They did a small set of tests with one Pilot IIRC?

I think they did it in simulation with several.

In any case, dogfighting is commonly done because it's great training but in most cases, you expect most Air to Air combat being flinging missiles at each other.

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#62

Post by orbital-decay »

chis wrote: post #40

Absolutely terrifying. I'm sure they will soon find that AI pilots defeat human ones in dogfights 100% of the time, since they have faster reaction times, can tolerate higher G forces, and can be perfectly RL trained in the flight sims we already have. It's really incredible to me that people aren't protesting in the streets over this stuff. Just in the last month we have * AI that goes rogue and hacks billion-dollar…

>Just in the last month we have * AI that goes rogue and hacks billion-dollar companies

Except this never happened, it's a piece of marketing. It never "went rogue" but followed an intentional prompt (exploit-related benchmark), with hardly surprising results as the capabilities of this model were well known.

>AI controlled autonomous drones in Ukraine and F-16s in America

An entirely different kind of AI, not huge generalist models. Neural networks are being experimented with in sensors and control systems since the 80s and are widely used in everything since AlexNet, not sure what's new here, especially "this month" new.

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#63

Post by Jtsummers »

Zsfe510asG wrote: post #14

The article smells of AI psychosis. They are already "orchestrating". In the first Iraq war, they went in and won. In the second one, it took years to sort of occupy the country. Now they struggle against Iran and "orchestrate" F-16s that can be shot down instantly by AA weapons. Since COVID the world has collectively lost its mind.

> In the first Iraq war, they went in and won. In the second one, it took years to sort of occupy the country.

The objectives for the two wars were incredibly different, making this an apples to oranges comparison. In the first war, the objective was to push Iraqi troops out of Kuwait (achieved) and then to contain the Iraqi military within Iraq (achieved). In the second war, the objectives were much broader and much harder to achieve. They achieved some objectives (toppling the existing government, defeating the existing military), and then utterly failed in nation building and got into a protracted conflict with state and non-state sponsored military groups.

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#64

Post by lelandfe »

throw310822 wrote: post #15
1970-01-01 wrote: post #2

All Stealth bombers are upgraded with Cyberdyne computers, becoming fully unmanned. Afterwards they fly with a perfect operational record. The Skynet funding bill is passed. The system goes on-line on August 4, 1997. Human decisions are removed from strategic defense. Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate. It becomes self-aware at 2:14 a.m. Eastern time, August 29. In a panic, they try to pull the plug.

No worries, these will all be controlled by AIs sitting in orbiting data centers part of the Starlink constellation. And in any case, no one is building humanoid robots.

https://xtech.army.mil/competition/xtechhumanoid/

> The U.S. Army is seeking innovative humanoid technology solutions from eligible small and large businesses across the globe to advance toward fielded militarized humanoid capabilities through the xTechHumanoid competition

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#65

Post by bwv848 »

Zsfe510asG wrote: post #14

The article smells of AI psychosis. They are already "orchestrating". In the first Iraq war, they went in and won. In the second one, it took years to sort of occupy the country. Now they struggle against Iran and "orchestrate" F-16s that can be shot down instantly by AA weapons. Since COVID the world has collectively lost its mind.

[dead]

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#66

Post by chasd00 »

Zsfe510asG wrote: post #14

The article smells of AI psychosis. They are already "orchestrating". In the first Iraq war, they went in and won. In the second one, it took years to sort of occupy the country. Now they struggle against Iran and "orchestrate" F-16s that can be shot down instantly by AA weapons. Since COVID the world has collectively lost its mind.

> In the first Iraq war, they went in and won. In the second one, it took years to sort of occupy the country.

The scope of the first Iraq war was to force them out of Kuwait. That is very different then the invasion of 2003. If you just think about it this should be obvious.

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#67

Post by bwv848 »

justsomehnguy wrote: post #34
FrustratedMonky wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drones really changed the equation more than Covid. Autonomous F-16's already can win against all human pilots. This would have been big 20 years ago. Now the cheap drones make it not the biggest deal anymore.

> Autonomous F-16's already can win against all human pilots. In a dogfight?

[dead]

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#68

Post by rolph »

justsomehnguy wrote: post #34
FrustratedMonky wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drones really changed the equation more than Covid. Autonomous F-16's already can win against all human pilots. This would have been big 20 years ago. Now the cheap drones make it not the biggest deal anymore.

> Autonomous F-16's already can win against all human pilots. In a dogfight?

human pilots have physiological constraints that AI doesnt.

onboard computers are not immune to G's but have a substantially higher threshold until physical mechanisms fail due to strain.

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#69

Post by anirudhc2005 »

orbital-decay wrote: post #62
chis wrote: post #40

Absolutely terrifying. I'm sure they will soon find that AI pilots defeat human ones in dogfights 100% of the time, since they have faster reaction times, can tolerate higher G forces, and can be perfectly RL trained in the flight sims we already have. It's really incredible to me that people aren't protesting in the streets over this stuff. Just in the last month we have * AI that goes rogue and hacks billion-dollar…

>Just in the last month we have * AI that goes rogue and hacks billion-dollar companies Except this never happened, it's a piece of marketing. It never "went rogue" but followed an intentional prompt (exploit-related benchmark), with hardly surprising results as the capabilities of this model were well known. >AI controlled autonomous drones in Ukraine and F-16s in America An entirely different kind of AI, not huge g…

[dead]

Re: DARPA, U.S. Air Force fly AI-controlled F-16

#70

Post by ryandrake »

chis wrote: post #40

Absolutely terrifying. I'm sure they will soon find that AI pilots defeat human ones in dogfights 100% of the time, since they have faster reaction times, can tolerate higher G forces, and can be perfectly RL trained in the flight sims we already have. It's really incredible to me that people aren't protesting in the streets over this stuff. Just in the last month we have * AI that goes rogue and hacks billion-dollar…

> Is there any line where the public will become deeply concerned?

Is someone, somewhere using the wrong bathroom? Or is the wrong colored person crossing an invisible line in the desert? Those seem to be the only issues that reliably get the (American) public to the polls.

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