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OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

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Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#311

Post by dang »

stego-tech wrote: post #34

And to think I got warned in another post that I need to be nicer/more professional in discussing this topic. Yeah. Nah. Bringing out the same drum I’ve been banging for years now , these companies have never actually cared about ensuring safe AI, regulation, or ensuring it benefits all humanity. It has always, always , been about control and their profit margins. Their actions have never reflected any sort of positi…

> I got warned in another post that I need to be nicer/more professional in discussing this topic

If you're talking about https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49016842, that's inaccurate, as anyone who follows the link can see. It has nothing to do with being professional, and doesn't relate to any specific topic. It has to do with the site rules at https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html, which you're plainly breaking.

We want curious conversation here, not indignant fulmination. These are incompatible, because the latter destroys the former the way wildfires destroy parks.

Since we don't want HN to turn into scorched earth, we have no choice but to ban accounts that repeatedly post like this. I don't want to ban you, but flagrantly doing again exactly what we just asked you to stop suggests that you don't want to use HN as intended. If that's wrong, and you actually do want to use HN as intended, please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and take the intended spirit of the site more to heart.

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#313

Post by syrrim »

solenoid0937 wrote: post #219
jacobgold wrote: post #44

Humanity discovered a technique for compressing the world's information into a few files that fit on a USB drive. It's just insane that some people thought they'd get to be the only ones who get to possess them.

This is such a naive take. What happens when "those files on a USB drive" turn into a zero day button that can harm millions of people? What happens when they help authoritarian dictatorships build nuclear weapons? What happens when they teach average people the steps needed to make a bioweapon at home? Every society restricts dangerous capabilities at the end of the day, because most people realize there is a crosso…

> What happens when "those files on a USB drive" turn into a zero day button that can harm millions of people?

We need to make sure only the chinese and criminals have that zero day button and western companies can't discover zero days in their own systems to protect themselves? Is that what you're getting at?

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#314

Post by bigyabai »

nunez wrote: post #249
axegon_ wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are relying on the same tactics Apple and Tesla used - loyal, fanatical fanbase drowning every legitimate criticism. Their fanatical fanbase is doing the real heavy lifting, not some joint-statement: "I haven't written any code in a year man, this is so good", "you are just a denier that will be irrelevant in 2 months", "you are not knowledgeable on the subject of ai", "you are just a hater" list goes on, I've h…

Interestingly, Apple will Sherlock the pants off of OpenAI and Anthropic once they release Siri+. At least for B2C.

They'll Sherlock part of it, but I don't think Apple's subscription will be seen as a threat to Codex or Claude Code.

The current B2C market is mostly comprised of power users, which will probably not be substantially displaced with a Siri update.

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#315

Post by palmotea »

bloppe wrote: post #179
palmotea wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you don’t address the ridiculous “copyright forever, nothing goes public domain” policies that got us to this place 1. You're mischaracterizing and exaggerating the policies to falsely support your point. Things go into the public domain all the time: https://web.law.duke.edu/cspd/publicdomainday/2026/ . 2. It's not like the model companies had the attitude "oh copyright is too long, we disagree on the term." Their…

They're attitude is more "this is fair use" which, according to all precedent, is probably true in most cases (unless the models actually start regurgitating huge parts of the Copyrighted material without a license). Of course, distillation is also fair use under Copyright law. Copyright was never meant to be a moral framework. It was always a practical framework designed to incentivize publishing that would ultimate…

> Copyright was never meant to be a moral framework. It was always a practical framework designed to incentivize publishing that would ultimately pass into the public domain.

A practical framework that model training breaks. Why publish a resource if it'll just get ingested by a model, and the model maker will get your customers/users instead of you? You're already seeing that with Google, which uses AI Overviews to cannibalize more and more traffic that would have once passed to a website.

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#316

Post by bigyabai »

solenoid0937 wrote: post #162

As usual, HN and the media think they understand AI safety and the implications of the race to RSI better than the people that have worked on this their whole lives.

The people that work on computational linguistics their whole lives are often theory-obsessed morons. Noam Chomsky was widely discredited even before we knew he was friends with Epstein.

If you think you can make a better case than Chomsky did, be my guest. Until then, those "researchers" will be rightfully mocked even by the scientific community: https://xkcd.com/114/

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#317

Post by solenoid0937 »

mring33621 wrote: post #270
solenoid0937 wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a naive take. What happens when "those files on a USB drive" turn into a zero day button that can harm millions of people? What happens when they help authoritarian dictatorships build nuclear weapons? What happens when they teach average people the steps needed to make a bioweapon at home? Every society restricts dangerous capabilities at the end of the day, because most people realize there is a crosso…

Some very bad people already have a "button that can harm millions of people". Some more very bad people are building them. This democratizes that ability. Might be good. Might be bad. Might be both. Fuck you for thinking you know better than everyone else.

This sort of thinking is what gets us into a world where journalists get bonesawed because some technolibertarians thought technology should be free.

You can give tools to defenders and not attackers. This is something that is possible to do.

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#318

Post by solenoid0937 »

myaccountonhn wrote: post #250
solenoid0937 wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Openness" is not inherently a good thing, this is a naive techno libertarian mindset. You don't hand every random script kiddie a zero day button. When models get better, you don't hand them an AGI that can help them make bioweapons or whatever. When it comes to intelligence, there is a limit to openness that any sane non-tech-libertarian would agree on.

Why should some unelected US-based technocrats with a terrible track record get to decide for us?

Are we pretending the HN crowd does not echo the view of "US-based technocrats?" This is a distilled (ha) echo chamber of SV VC's views, who are coincidentally pushing the same narrative.

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#319

Post by solenoid0937 »

timmytokyo wrote: post #269
prodigycorp wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It also doesn't seem to know what it wants. When Trump blocks Fable "there needs to be proper legislation, not an authoritarian controlling this". When an article discusses the legislative process "F' these companies!".

Consider that HN is not a single person with a single point of view.

Could have fooled me.

Re: OpenAI and Anthropic unite against open-weight AI risks to their bottom line

#320

Post by bigyabai »

solenoid0937 wrote: post #317
mring33621 wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some very bad people already have a "button that can harm millions of people". Some more very bad people are building them. This democratizes that ability. Might be good. Might be bad. Might be both. Fuck you for thinking you know better than everyone else.

This sort of thinking is what gets us into a world where journalists get bonesawed because some technolibertarians thought technology should be free. You can give tools to defenders and not attackers. This is something that is possible to do.

> This sort of thinking is what gets us into a world where journalists get bonesawed

Journalists get bonesawed because of an abuse of the concentration of power, which is what you're directly advocating for.

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