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Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

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Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#21

Post by ForHackernews »

andai wrote: post #7

There seems to be some confusion here (including in the linked discussion?) about what this is. This is not continuing the development on the original Bun (Zig) codebase. It is extracting a subset of that codebase for deployment purposes. The full version of Bun (presumably in Rust?) will continue to be used for actual development. So it is not a replacement for Bun, but a supplement to it. https://news.ycombinator.c…

> Cruller is not intended to replace Bun for development. It is a minimal, specialized runtime for executing production code.

> In any case, I do not want to throw away such a large codebase that has taken several years to build. It makes more sense to turn it into a convenient embeddable library that can be used throughout the Zig ecosystem.

This seems pretty sensible to me. It's nice if the Zig ecosystem has an embeddable JS runtime.

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#23

Post by aureate »

jdw64 wrote: post #14

But according to Andrew Kelly, Bun was full of bad Zig practices. So why did they keep pushing forward with Zig?

Indeed it's surprising, given the zig compiler famously causes all developers who use it to merge into a single organism with a combined nervous system.

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#24

Post by make3 »

aureate wrote: post #23
jdw64 wrote: post #14

But according to Andrew Kelly, Bun was full of bad Zig practices. So why did they keep pushing forward with Zig?

Indeed it's surprising, given the zig compiler famously causes all developers who use it to merge into a single organism with a combined nervous system.

The Zirgs they call them (I'm kidding)

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#25

Post by Juncture0 »

jdw64 wrote: post #14

But according to Andrew Kelly, Bun was full of bad Zig practices. So why did they keep pushing forward with Zig?

It seems you misunderstand what happened to Bun: Anthropic has burned some investor money for a PR stunt -- our LLM can port this -- and also to punish Zig which dared to ban LLM contributions by taking away a significant project from the ecosystem. It worked, Rust didn't dare to enact a similar ban.

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#26

Post by virajk_31 »

Juncture0 wrote: post #25
jdw64 wrote: post #14

But according to Andrew Kelly, Bun was full of bad Zig practices. So why did they keep pushing forward with Zig?

It seems you misunderstand what happened to Bun: Anthropic has burned some investor money for a PR stunt -- our LLM can port this -- and also to punish Zig which dared to ban LLM contributions by taking away a significant project from the ecosystem. It worked, Rust didn't dare to enact a similar ban.

Anthropic tried hard to port using their LLMs but their models were not trained on enough zig corpus hence failed and they blamed it on Zig's principles

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#27

Post by virajk_31 »

romanovcode wrote: post #22
jdw64 wrote: post #14

But according to Andrew Kelly, Bun was full of bad Zig practices. So why did they keep pushing forward with Zig?

Because their ego got hurt that a big project decided to not use their "amazing" language.

No it's vice versa

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#28

Post by jonkoops »

flohofwoe wrote: post #11
pjmlp wrote: post #6

As usual, most forks created out of community rupture eventually die.

I think there are quite a few high profile examples where the fork was successful (egcs comes to mind which eventually became the official gcc, also all the BSD flavours). And even when the fork ultimately isn't successful, it sometimes at least forces the original project to adapt (e.g. ffmpeg vs libav). E.g. "it's difficult to make predicitions, especially about the future" ;) PS: of course for this specific projec…

Same goes for io.js, which got so popular it actually got merged back into Node.js

Re: Cruller: Bun's Zig Runtime, Continued on Zig 0.16

#30

Post by maleldil »

youre-wrong3 wrote: post #17
audunw wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why feel bad? If you’re using Zig to write a game or a system tool why should you care if Bun uses it or not? All this drama has very little impact on most users of Zig or its developers (some financial impact, but Andrew had already foreseen that as a risk and avoided depending on it) libghostty is more impactful than Bun IMO. It doesn’t matter to most other developers that Bun was written in Zig, but that such a a…

This is really clutching at straws to justify zigs existence.

You don't need to "justify" Zig's existence. It exists, and people like it, and that's enough. IMHO, I wouldn't use it, but there are valid use cases, even if it's "just" a nicer C.
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