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Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

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Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#221

Post by TitaRusell »

98codes wrote: post #182
rconti wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the average person actually knows anything concrete about them. They're a proxy for peoples' sense of powerlessness about what's going on around them. Skyrocketing electricity prices, the sense that elected officials aren't looking out for their interests, job losses, etc. They're a convenient proxy for many disparate concerns because they represent all of those things in one way or another.

> I don't think the average person actually knows anything concrete about them. The average person around them knows quite a bit about the noise level, and how far it carries. They're starting to learn about the effect consistent noise at that level has on their mental & physical well-being as well.

The Pittsburgh steel mills provided jobs and a sense of purpose to communities.

Something that tech bros fundamentally oppose.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#223

Post by zapataband2 »

mrngld wrote: post #143
rsoto2 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the AI Datacenters are much worse for the environment. xAI is using methane-turbines to power theirs, and they are allowed to pollute your communities because they bribed the Trump admin. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2026/jun/16/elon-musk... https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/data-centers/elon-musk-... https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1014655584252361

I have some degree of sympathy for data centers, and anyone else that needs power, only because of how broken our regulatory state is on approving new transmission. To be clear, it's not just data centers that have this problem. Journalists have been spilling digital ink on this topic as it relates to solar and wind farms as well. It's also part of the thing that'd hold back rapid deployment of nuclear. If there's a…

[dead]

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#224

Post by strictnein »

pibaker wrote: post #212
strictnein wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Russia has been doing it for decades and it would be foolish to assume China didn't learn from them. Thomas Rid's "Active Measures" covers this in detail, and it's somewhat maddening to read, because it details how much of the civil strife we've experienced that was exacerbated by their actions. https://www.amazon.com/Active-Measures-History-Disinformatio...

How is "Anyone who disagrees with me is a Russian troll" working out for you liberals?

Not what is being claimed here and stating that shows a complete lack of understanding of the term Active Measures, the history of it, and what the book of the same name discusses.

Also, it's amusing you think you know my political leanings or that it would somehow affect the accuracy of what is being discussed. It's strange how people think that they can win arguments by casting the person they're debating into some group they've decided is already wrong.

Anyways, go google the term and then pretend like you knew what it was all along and that you're an expert on Russian influence campaigns of the 20th and 21st centuries. That works well on Twitter and Reddit, maybe it'll work here too?

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#225

Post by moduspol »

redlewel wrote: post #30

I think this is because the demand is so extreme for datacenters now that companies are building them in a manner that disrupts the environment around them. The newer ones are using on-site generators that are insanely loud and require multiples more power than datacenters have historically needed. For a rack with traditional servers with just RAM/CPU/Drives, 5kW is sufficient in most cases. When you have racks that…

It's that, but it's also that AI is not visibly providing any tangible benefit for most people. It'd be one thing if you had to tolerate a datacenter at the edge of town, but at least now you have a robot to fold your clean clothes. Instead, you get the threat of losing your job, the privilege of dealing with AI customer service chatbots, and higher energy costs.

I think most datacenter criticisms are actually coming from people who were going to oppose them anyway. Though a lot of their criticisms are valid, too.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#227

Post by bjustin »

econ wrote: post #190
srmatto wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there's truth to what you're saying but I also think there's truth to what people are experiencing and perceiving. A highly power and/or water consumptive data center being installed in a town or city is pretty much a perfect embodiment of people's frustrations. It consumes tons of power and/or water and therefore drives up utility costs for the locals or pollutes the air with diesel exhaust. And it doesn't c…

https://www.tumblr.com/geneseelibby/35053843499/a-horrible-m...

Amazingly, they managed to _undersell_ the ill effects that the oil industry would have on even just the US, such as the oil-driven military actions we've taken over the years.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#228

Post by lightedman »

RajT88 wrote: post #24
gortok wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think there’s a lot of social media influence from nation state competitors going on to try and slow SOTA development in the US. This comes cross as unbelievable, and at worst a fantastical statement, as someone who lives in Northern Virginia and is effectively watching the Datacenter battle unfold from the front lines, and dealing with the local politics and electricity costs rising at a precipitous rate. Our el…

They're building a mass of DC's near me as well in northern IL (not quite as many as by you). I see a lot of weird stuff on social media - people inactive for years all of a sudden becoming super-activists and posting non-stop anti-DC content. Nearly identical content to what's being pushed by a bunch of faceless accounts named like "Water4All","Nature Reign" - something vaguely environmental sounding. Talking points…

"there's no such thing as a closed loop system"

That's not incorrect though; you're still needing to shed the heat energy SOMEWHERE. Thermodynamics alone dictates that basic fact. You may not waste the cooling solution but all that excessive GPU heat is going to need to go somewhere - and the only place it ultimately goes is right into the environment.

Ever stand a bit away from a campfire because you got too warm, only to have the wind hit it and blow hot air over you? Same thought exercise applies here.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#229

Post by titanomachy »

mindcandy wrote: post #55

I find what people want from the data center build-out is pretty reasonable: 1. Don't build loud machines across the street from someone's house. 2. Don't drive up water/electricity bills by pulling from the municipal grid. 3. Don't burn the earth with CO2. 4. Don't facilitate techno-fascist surveillance. 5. Pay a lot of taxes. But, when I see people complain about data centers, I usually see a spiral of rage-bait ba…

I did some analysis on this, although I’m not a finance expert. If you put $100M of GPUs in a Virginia datacenter then you might pay $2M per year in local taxes over the 5 year life of the equipment. (I don’t think tech companies tend to pay much corporate income tax.) If you took the same money and put up an office with 150 people making $150k/year, you’d pay less property tax but like $7M in income taxes, not to mention the other taxes those people pay as they go about their lives nearby, and the fact that their incomes are re-invested in the community. So companies shifting their spending from employees to GPUs seems to massively reduce their tax burden, and datacenters are a vastly worse deal than offices for whatever community ends up stuck with them.

It does seem like civil society could hold out for a better deal here, and not lose what little tax base we are currently getting from these tech giants.

Re: Most Americans say "not in my backyard" to AI data centers

#230

Post by bjustin »

srmatto wrote: post #176
rconti wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the average person actually knows anything concrete about them. They're a proxy for peoples' sense of powerlessness about what's going on around them. Skyrocketing electricity prices, the sense that elected officials aren't looking out for their interests, job losses, etc. They're a convenient proxy for many disparate concerns because they represent all of those things in one way or another.

I think there's truth to what you're saying but I also think there's truth to what people are experiencing and perceiving. A highly power and/or water consumptive data center being installed in a town or city is pretty much a perfect embodiment of people's frustrations. It consumes tons of power and/or water and therefore drives up utility costs for the locals or pollutes the air with diesel exhaust. And it doesn't c…

I've heard talk from some folks telling these people that their concerns about data center water use, power, noise etc. are overblown. Water companies disagree, saying data center water usage in fact is quite significant. Oops. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2026/jul/21/not-enou...
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