Live data from Hacker News

Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

blog.ericgoldman.org

501–510 of 597 posts

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#501
post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quotas?

Dunno, probably just easier to “catch” people who think that they are good people, they think the police is on their side.

People who chronically are in trouble with the cops pretty quickly learn the police are working against them.

Regular people having a bad moment think they can just explain everything to the police and they'll go "Ah, sorry mate, we misunderstood and you can go home now"

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#502
I have to point out that the united states absolutely does not, under any context, care about the health and wellbeing of children. If they did they would have good, easy to access free healthcare and support for families including parental leave, as well as a good public school system that served every single child adequately.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#503
post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I could find was that there are estimated to be about 350-500 million firearms in the US. The closest thing to a breakdown was 30-50 million semi-auto rifles, and probably close to a 60/40 split handgun to long gun over time (article shows trends). Murders per year using rifles and shotguns were less than 600 combined. Handguns accounted for over 6000. So the number of hanguns is maybe something like 20% higher…

Rifles are problematic as a single category since that involves hunting rifles. We can look at machine guns as a category that is neither rifle or handgun, and with limited use in hunting. That said, the death rate of machine gun ownership may still be lower than handgun ownership, with a possible explanation being that it is easier to buy a handgun compared to a machine gun. A further jump into the data would then e…

Full auto handguns are quite popular now despite being effectively illegal.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> yet almost nothing seems to be done to prevent CSA. for the UK, there has been a massive shift to prevent this kind of stuff. anyone who even volunteers with children or vulnerable adults needs to be screened. Charities are required to have policies for dealing with vulnerable people safely. but to the point, Apple halfarse CSAM reporting. Whatsapp which doesn't do "CSAM scanning" reports in one hour more CSAM than…

> anyone who even volunteers with children or vulnerable adults needs to be screened as far as i am aware, that is common practice in many countries. the problem is that screening is typically a quick check of "has this person been suspected or arrested for something involving minors already" and perhaps a few questions on a piece of paper. its not like they give everyone volunteering for a fieldtrip an extensive 1:1…

I just looked it up, its the ncmec.org annual report, the one I am referencing is from 2024, not 2021. I mis remembered

Apple reported 250 items

Instagram 3.1million whatsapp 1.1 million facebook 8.8million tiktok 1.3 million snapchat 1.1million

Look I hate meta, more than you would know. But apple have very little excuse here. Even Anthropic reported more CSAM than them. I get your point about group vs 1:1, but frankly that holds only a tiny amount of water. Even if you did want to report it, you can't, not through apple at least. And if you did report it to the police, there is a high chance you'll loose your phone for use as evidence.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#505
post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lowest of the low hanging political points scoring fruit will be picked. I make this point on HN each time it comes up: Dealing with actual CSA requires actual people going to investigate actual reports of children's living conditions out in the real world, not "scanning digital files". Seems obvious when you say it like that, but the alternative seems to still score heavily on the political scale. Ironically, sp…

Children also need to understand that they have been abused and know who they can talk to for them to be able to report abuse to a trusted adult. Unfortunately that requires children to learn about sexuality and autonomy which for some reason conservatives think is abuse to teach children.

Part of the problem is that the topic is so radioactive, that coming forward with a story of abuse, and the legal/media circus that follows, really puts the abuse center stage in people's view of you. Most people absolutely do not want their most defining attribute to be "person whose family member raped them", even if it comes with extreme sympathy and understanding.

For many, probably most victims, they just want to forget about it and let it vanish into the past, and ideally someone else who was abused by that person comes out and has them jailed.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> anyone who even volunteers with children or vulnerable adults needs to be screened as far as i am aware, that is common practice in many countries. the problem is that screening is typically a quick check of "has this person been suspected or arrested for something involving minors already" and perhaps a few questions on a piece of paper. its not like they give everyone volunteering for a fieldtrip an extensive 1:1…

I just looked it up, its the ncmec.org annual report, the one I am referencing is from 2024, not 2021. I mis remembered Apple reported 250 items Instagram 3.1million whatsapp 1.1 million facebook 8.8million tiktok 1.3 million snapchat 1.1million Look I hate meta, more than you would know. But apple have very little excuse here. Even Anthropic reported more CSAM than them. I get your point about group vs 1:1, but fran…

>Apple reported 250 items

Instagram 3.1million whatsapp 1.1 million facebook 8.8million tiktok 1.3 million snapchat 1.1million

those numbers seem absolutely in line with what i would expect when comparing the largest social media platforms on the planet and a company that does 0 social media and extremely limited group sharing.

it seems very strange to me to put any blame apple here when its just a statistics game. billions of image posts = millions of reports. simple as.

and anyways, if i received CSAM from one of my phone contacts im going directly to the local police, skipping the apple -> ncmec -> state -> local pipeline. i think most people would be in the same boat.

a report button is useful when you don't know the identity of the perpetrator. but when you do know them, you should be going to actual law enforcement, not hoping your report eventually gets routed to the right agency.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#507

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Banning firearms isn't "dead cheap" if you have 400 million in existence. The enforcement would cost a lot, even if you didn't perform a mandatory buyback program. Germany doesn't have an outright ban on guns, but strict regulation. Running the regulation costs money. A note about copying - you have to look at the culture to see if how things will work. Germany has vastly different socioeconomics than the US, and soc…

> Applying the same regulations in the US will take decades for criminals to no longer have many guns and then they will switch to knives and screwdrivers as we see in the UK That seems like a thing to pursue rather earlier than later if it takes so long to bear fruits. Knives and screwdrivers are at least only used for close-up combat. >The best approach would be to address the underlying factors and causes of all v…

"Knives and screwdrivers are at least only used for close-up combat."

Most firearms murders are similarly close-up.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#508

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> just give the receipts. Just read my last comment I posted two hours before you posted yours? > you’re ignoring as well. You're assuming facts not in evidence. > We could say that rate should be examined per hour because a kid will spend 30 hours per week at school vs... "Don't worry Timmy, even though you were molested at school, because you're forced to go there every (week)day and spend more time there than chur…

>No one who actually was a Scout would call their Scoutmaster a "troop manager". I was a scout and I natively speak Spanish, so I never learned what the ranks are called in English (and after nearly 30 years I've pretty much completely forgotten them in Spanish too, if I'm being honest). Are you going to call me a liar too?

Wow, you all do not stop. You've been grinding your ax so long now, it could cut a hair. If you were a Scout, you would know your ax should not be that sharp.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#509

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you said explicitly that kids are sexually assaulted at a higher rate in schools than they are in churches or scouts. You clarified that you mean per 100,000 children more are likely to be sexually assaulted in schools. Usually when someone has a belief like this, it’s grounded by something that they read or learned somewhere. Where did you learn this? Why aren’t you sharing the source with everyone else so they…

> just give the receipts. Just read my last comment I posted two hours before you posted yours? > you’re ignoring as well. You're assuming facts not in evidence. > We could say that rate should be examined per hour because a kid will spend 30 hours per week at school vs... "Don't worry Timmy, even though you were molested at school, because you're forced to go there every (week)day and spend more time there than chur…

> I already gave the "receipts". Stop trying to gaslight me.

Not to me and not when I asked. And you just applied waaaay more effort than it would have taken.

> Don't worry Timmy, even though you were molested at school, because you're forced to go there every (week)day and spend more time there than church, Boy Scouts, etc, you statistically had less of a chance per hour of being molested.

No, but as a parent it becomes part of your risk assessment when deciding if you want your kid to become an altar boy.

Re: Apple defeats liability for not scanning iCloud for CSAM

#510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, until at least one non-ringleader Epstein party participant goes to jail, I'm not going to believe the US actually gives a shit about protecting children.

There’s no concrete evidence that anyone besides Epstein (and by extension Maxwell, who assisted Epstein) actually abused children. Besides the testimony of Virginia Giuffre, nobody else has claimed they were sexually assaulted as minors (Sjoberg was groped by Prince Andrew at Epstein’s home when she was in her early 20s). And neither the FBI nor the Palm Beach PD found physical evidence of such or communications bet…

There's plenty of concrete evidence. But - for some reason - Trump's government has refused to release it, defying multiple legal judgements.
Post reply on HN