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Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

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Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#121

Post by blackqueeriroh »

paxys wrote: post #71
pier25 wrote: post #57

This is not even than a slap on the wrist. Publishers who negotiated this really fucked up writers. According to US federal law, pirating a single copyrighted work and gaining commercial advantage of it (which Anthropic 100% did) represents five years in prison and a $250,000 fine. But it gets worse: "Penalties for a copyright infringement conviction may increase if the defendant has previous similar convictions, mad…

It's valid to not take AI companies' side here but people who think publishers are fighing for the little guy's rights are delusional. Tech companies have been exploiting artists for a few years, publishers/record labels/media companies have been doing it for centuries.

THANK YOU! And the idea that copyright actually helps individuals is such bullshit I can’t even believe anyone believes it! On a site filled with free software advocates.

Absurd.

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#122

Post by brlewis »

driverdan wrote: post #70

Judge Alsup issued the original order that determined they were liable for piracy but that training LLMs on books was fair use. It's worth reading if you're interested in the topic. https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/69058235/231/bartz-v-an...

Yes, that is interesting. It sounds like he was aware of the theoretical possibility of a book being regurgitated verbatim. Do you know if he was aware it had been done? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49000742

If he was not aware, I wonder if he still would have described the process as "exceedingly transformative" had he been aware.

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#123

Post by broodbucket »

blackqueeriroh wrote: post #120

For anyone who thinks the problem is Anthropic, I want you all to know that most authors make less than the median income. Most make less than $20,000 a year, because publishing houses give authors an advance, and then authors must pay back that entire advance in sales before they see a dollar of profit from their work. Most never do. Maybe publishers should JUST pay authors WELL, and get a book every 2-3 years. http…

There can be more than one problem at once

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#124

Post by debo_ »

koolba wrote: post #102
theplumber wrote: post #72

But why not jail like Kim Dotcom? And why no Feds jumping on Dario’s window? They are not only pirating, they also resell it!

Kill a man you’re a murderer. Kill a thousand, you’re a conqueror.

Kill them all... Oooooaaahhhhh you're a goddd

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#125

Post by blackqueeriroh »

PunchyHamster wrote: post #18
Varelion wrote: post #8

I sincerely don't understand what the point of these laws are, when the cost of flagrant violations is no more than a slap on the wrist -- these really meager sums that serve as nothing more than something to point at and say "Look, we did something!" Cover-your-ass strategy, and nothing more. Who, besides the ones at fault, are ever happy with these mean-nothing fines? The justice system really needs an overhaul wit…

To keep users paying for content while companies do whatever they want - and if that's not the reason that's certainly an effect. > The justice system really needs an overhaul with how it tackles "justice" between the wealthy, the connected, the corporations, and the rest. Though I am unsure what that would look like. Minimum net wealth per category of infraction across the board? % of annual turnover seems like dece…

So you now believe fair use should not exist?

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#126

Post by _carbyau_ »

protocolture wrote: post #76
timmmmmmay wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it is. If I write a movie review and sell it to a magazine or whatever, it's derived from the movie, and it's fair use, and I don't need to ask the movie owner for permission first, or give them a cut of my sales. Even if I use some reasonable number of screenshots and video clips, as long as the resulting work is "transformative" i.e. actually a new work, a movie review instead of a copy of the movie. Do y…

>I constantly see people in the AI debate working themselves into wildly copyright maximalist positions I really dont get this. I know its that conflation fallacy or whatever, but I was under the impression we had sort of gotten over copyright maximalism as a society after Napster etc. Whats worse is that, meaningful reform in this space has basically been waiting on a multi billion dollar corporation to come along a…

There's two issues with copyright.

1. author owns the right to distribute copies of the work

2. this right goes on for faaaaaar too long.

I don't have an issue with 1. You had a good idea, you implemented it, you deserve something for it. Given some people got sued into oblivion with ridiculous dollar value outcomes on a per unit basis - why doesn't this apply here? Sure 1.5 billion is a lot. But the number of infringments is insane and the company is approaching a trillion in valuation. You could make it ten times that number.

I do have an issue with 2. Sure, you had a good idea, you implemented it, you deserve something for it. But after 20 years, you should be able to come up with another idea or just work like the rest of us. Going for 50, 70, 90+ years with the rewards going to estate heirs? Fuck that.

So yeah, I am both against copyright AND surprised at the slap on the wrist for what happened here.

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#128

Post by ori_b »

blackqueeriroh wrote: post #115

Death to copyright, which has always been far more harmful to small authors and creators than it has even been to large companies.

Let's have that conversation after the people strip mining the livelihoods of creators cough up for UBI.

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#129

Post by mountainriver »

jdlshore wrote: post #4

To be clear, the issue is not that the books were used to train Claude, but that they were pirated.

This is why you should always distill your models from a competitor.

Let them take on the liability

Re: Judge approves $1.5B Anthropic settlement for pirated books used to train Claude

#130

Post by unsungNovelty »

IncreasePosts wrote: post #78
theplumber wrote: post #72

But why not jail like Kim Dotcom? And why no Feds jumping on Dario’s window? They are not only pirating, they also resell it!

Kim built something designed to help everyone pirate stuff. Anthropic pirated specific content.

As soon as we start conditioning ethics, we give up and undermine the principles behind those ethics.

- @Nevermark

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