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The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

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Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#181

Post by testing22321 »

maratc wrote: post #12

The point missing in the article is that, in order to enter the US, one needs to give the US Govt their photo and fingerprints ("biometric data") anyway. There are two options: visa-free with the biometric data passing on the wire (no hassle), or visa (a major hassle) and biometric data passing in the airport (a minor one). As a side note, the EU also collects photo and fingerprints from visitors now. Whereas in the…

> in the US you only need to go through fingerprinting only once (or maybe "once per passport")

I’ve entered the US something like 150 times over 20 years. Visa free (ESTA) and on a B1 tourist visa.

I’ve been fingerprinted and photographed every single time.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#182

Post by florakel »

maratc wrote: post #12

The point missing in the article is that, in order to enter the US, one needs to give the US Govt their photo and fingerprints ("biometric data") anyway. There are two options: visa-free with the biometric data passing on the wire (no hassle), or visa (a major hassle) and biometric data passing in the airport (a minor one). As a side note, the EU also collects photo and fingerprints from visitors now. Whereas in the…

No, if you don’t change your passport you only have to scan your fingerprints once in the EU.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#183

Post by MarceliusK »

dinkelberg wrote: post #137
eigenspace wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's unclear to me here is this: under this new scheme does the USA get access to the biometric data of people not travelling to the USA?

From the analysis linked in TFA: "The automated query can be based on: * Identity information included in the application or in travel documents, such as name, date of birth, national ID number, and/or * the fingerprint of an individual." Sounds like they could send requests to that computer system just based on publicly available information on a person like name and date of birth, even if the person never applied f…

It changes the nature of the scheme quite a bit

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#184

Post by jq-r »

happymellon wrote: post #145
maratc wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, it could depend on the type of visa too. I only enter for tourism (B2 I think) and have never overstayed.

Never overstaying, always fingerprinted on arrival.

Fingerprinted once 12 years ago, never again. Traveled on ESTA.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#185

Post by mothballed »

anvuong wrote: post #166
mothballed wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is legal to show up at a port of entry without any sort of anything. If all it allows you to do is show up at the port of entry it's a worthless scrap of paper.

Not for airlines and international cruise ships with US as destination. The attendants won't let you board unless you have a valid US visas. Carriers get fined if they transport individuals with no proper documents to a US port of entry.

Airlines are fined for inadmissible passengers. Whether they have a visa or not. If they have no visa but are admitted there is no such fine.

The visa is immaterial to the fine unless it conveys something beyond merely allowing you to present at a port of entry, which is allowed to basically everyone.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#186

Post by saturn8601 »

traceroute66 wrote: post #127
saturn8601 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10 years ago I walked right past the French immigration officer by accident because I didn't know where I was going. He yelled at me to get back in line, quickly stamped my passport and then shooed my along. EU has become a lot more like the US. I'd probably been detained if I had done that in the US. Last year visiting Switzerland they had these machines that auto adjust a camera to your height and there was no way…

> Now it being digitized there is no wiggle room on exit/entry. Yes. Because the primary issue is it was too easy to fly under the radar once you were in the Schengen zone. Also in 2026 there are security threats which means tighter borders is a necessity. Clearly in 2026, the easiest way to achieve compliance at all Schengen borders accross 29 countries is to digitise it, including biometrics. Yes, to put it politel…

Well just to clarify as I am not sure if you understood what I am saying but when I said wiggle room I was referring to the different standards of enforcement applied by different countries. This is why I gave personal anecdotes. Im sure all EU countries have days where enforcement is strict and other days where enforcement is more lax. The problems implementing the digital system are a problem but it is a separate issue from the intended design goals of the system. Namely now you have a minimum layer of immigration enforcement across the union given that it is a unified digitized system. It is still more fair and straightforward than the US system and I commend them for setting a minimum standard that I hope others can aspire to. I am unsure about the privacy implications. It is a tough subject to think about. It was nice not having to have any stress going through immigration a year ago. But that is my bias as a young person feeling anxious of first traveling to Europe and being excited for seeing the countries and meeting the unique people for the first time.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#187

Post by bilekas »

maratc wrote: post #12

The point missing in the article is that, in order to enter the US, one needs to give the US Govt their photo and fingerprints ("biometric data") anyway. There are two options: visa-free with the biometric data passing on the wire (no hassle), or visa (a major hassle) and biometric data passing in the airport (a minor one). As a side note, the EU also collects photo and fingerprints from visitors now. Whereas in the…

> in the EU you need to go through it both on every arrival and every departure.

You absolutely don't. If you've done it once on your passport/ID you don't need to do it again. And infact there are fast track autonomous lanes that you can just scan your EU passport with biometric chip and fly through. (In theory, there's always idiots who don't realise they don't have it)

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#188

Post by MarceliusK »

Vinnl wrote: post #14

It's not clear to me if this would allow access to all biometric data, or "just" to that of people crossing the US border? And for the latter, what data are we talking about? If it's mostly fingerprints, don't those already get collected upon crossing the border? And can't they already be read from a passport's chip?

If it lets the US use that identity to query European databases and retrieve associated information, that is a much larger change

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#189

Post by meibo »

eigenspace wrote: post #139
dinkelberg wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the analysis linked in TFA: "The automated query can be based on: * Identity information included in the application or in travel documents, such as name, date of birth, national ID number, and/or * the fingerprint of an individual." Sounds like they could send requests to that computer system just based on publicly available information on a person like name and date of birth, even if the person never applied f…

Well, a national ID number isnt usually publicly available info, even if it can be obtained by the US government through illicit means. But yeah, it does sound that way, but certainly not clear cut to me what the situation is. I.e. does the agreement involve clauses about what to do if this is abused? Do we have a way to detect if theyre using this on non-travellers? Etc.

In multiple European countries, national ID numbers are public information that can be searched by name and address (i.e. Sweden)

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#190

Post by gib444 »

throw-the-towel wrote: post #136
gib444 wrote: post #87

On "selling out" claims. Yet again people not reading the article and trying to misrepresent who was the driving force: > In 2022, the US government announced that it would require access to biometric databases of countries if they wish to keep visa exemption for their citizens travelling to the US Big bad eu !!11!?!

So, that wasn't even Trump.

I wasn't trying to highlight who was president or not
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