161–170 of 243 posts
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You use a very vague language to tie violence in Sweden to immigrants. Then you link a study without really going much about how the study supports your claims, as if that is evidence of what you suggest. You are gesturing to one thing - "there's a study on gang violence in Sweden" - and presenting it as evidence of another thing - "immigrants are to blame for gang violence". So I decided to engage with it and read t…
> So I decided to engage with it and read the damn thing Huh, so did I... but clearly one of us didn't read it thoroughly enough. The first sentence of the abstract says the surge in shootings is "disproportionately involving young men with immigrant backgrounds". Page 2: people with an immigrant background are 80% of shooting victims and 64% of perpetrators (citing Brå). You seem to just skip to the theory section p…
We can agree that the 'all' part was just the original commenters own biases, but that 'refugee' part is still unfounded based on your quotes.
Refugees are a small minority of immigrants (historically around 10%, don't know what it is in Sweden). The quotes you cite are about immigrants, and the few nationalities mentioned are Turkey and Serbia: neither is a country where refugees originate (except maybe LGBT people, but I'd be very surprised if Sweden is in the thrall of gay Turks...).
So the assertion about immigrant backgrounds seems to hold, but nothing says it's related to refugees, otherwise the large majority of these criminals would be Afghan, Syrian, Eritrean, etc., which doesn't seem to be the case.
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I think we can call most of these social forces Putin (although there are real problems with immigration). Ok, in Australia they can probably be called Murdoch
The mainstream media plays into this for sure. But I think there is a lot more to it. I think most of us on this platform have cosmopolitan leanings. We're educated and have some job mobility. I've worked overseas because I got an engineering education and did well in it. But wage stagnation, job insecurity, housing costs, low rental vacancy all play into this dynamic. There are a lot of people who don't like seeing…
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I don't know enough about this specific party, but a quick look at the Wikipedia page about them shows this quote, which to me does seem to suggest that the label is defensible: > In a podcast segment about immigration and deportations Allard stated his opinion and said that "They will also be forced to leave, even if they are born in Sweden, because they have no natural connection to Sweden. They are not Swedish." h…
Sweden doesn't appear to have birthright citizenship (jus soli), so people whose only connection to Sweden is being born there are in fact not swedish. If this is your definition of ethnonationalism, then most of the world is already ethnonationalist.
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For non-Swedes, all the links with the domain "bra.se" is the government department for prevention of crime, and as part of that role has been given the objective from the government to collect crime statistic. They provide data, conclusions and advice the government on how to effectively combat crime. They also have direct access to police and court databases in order to achieve their objectives. They are the offici…
I find it fascinating that people in this thread are arguing against raw government crime statistics and are asking for further evidence of this problem.
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I guess we're all just using our own definition of freedom. It'll make reasonable discussions incredibly difficult however.
To make things clear my definition of a free society is one where the society itself governs how it is run. The opposite of this is when another country, organization, or person is dictating how it is run overriding how the society wants to do things.
However, support for migration is not a left or right issue. Accepting refugees might be (and I fully support that), but non-refugee immigration (the vast majority of it) is not an unalloyed good.
Immigration has a number of negative effects, on housing, employment and wages, inequalities, social cohesion, political direction.
Being a radical leftist and against immigration is not contradictory.
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There are social forces that are shifting the collective mindset to be more sympathetic to anti immigration sentiments. We see it in Australia recently, but the political analysis of this phenomenon is still lagging from my perspective (I am not endorsing these sentiments).
I think we can call most of these social forces Putin (although there are real problems with immigration). Ok, in Australia they can probably be called Murdoch
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The mainstream media plays into this for sure. But I think there is a lot more to it. I think most of us on this platform have cosmopolitan leanings. We're educated and have some job mobility. I've worked overseas because I got an engineering education and did well in it. But wage stagnation, job insecurity, housing costs, low rental vacancy all play into this dynamic. There are a lot of people who don't like seeing…
I largely agree
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Sweden doesn't appear to have birthright citizenship (jus soli), so people whose only connection to Sweden is being born there are in fact not swedish. If this is your definition of ethnonationalism, then most of the world is already ethnonationalist.
Not having birthright citizenship doesn't mean that you can't acquire citizenship.
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It could be a response, but the point I was making was that while saying "criminals should be expelled" might sound reasonable to many, defining what exactly you mean with criminal is extremely important. If the party comes to power and the law they'll actually enact says "If you violated any law you can be expelled", it would make anyone easily expellable.
this kind of slippery slope is why I hate vague rules on forums, let alone national laws. Selective enforcement of those you find disagreeable is a way of bullying people with impunity. That said, I'm curious on how you would solve the issue that Sweden is faced with. It is a very outsized, pronounced, issue and the legal system in Sweden is not equipped to deal with it. The Swedish legal system prioritises rehabilit…
Do search for the causes and strive to solve them, I doubt that the only possible solution (if it were a solution) is mass deportations.
Insufficient integration efforts could well be at the root of a lot of the immigrant crime problems; I agree with striving to integrate immigrants, to the point that I agree to a lot of what I see at https://web.archive.org/web/20200120174720/http://www.orebro... (2020, not on their site anymore).
I think you should demand committed acceptance of some core values to new immigrants, and I can agree with expulsion after serious enough violations of those.
And I'm not a fan of having as much immigration as possible.