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The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

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Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#41

Post by rocqua »

Under the assumption that this framework is somewhat sane and only shares biometric data of those people who actually request an ESTA, I don't see the issue.

This data already leaks whenever you travel legally to the US, because they take it from you as a requirement of entry. All this does is let them check the data they take on entry against the provided data. Which seems fair. The fact this data is already in passports is a very different matter, but that is something the EU has done voluntarily.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#42

Post by toymin »

inigyou wrote: post #30
cm2187 wrote: post #18

I fail to understand the distinction between an ESTA and a visa to be honest. You need to do the paperwork in advance, pay, provide all sort of personal information, and it can be denied, and if approved only for a limited amount of time. Given that both the EU and the UK have reciprocated, it is a fiction that there exists some visa free travel between these 3 zones. And the more hassle you create, the less tourism…

A visa allows you entry, an ESTA doesn't allow you entry but just says you're allowed to travel to the border to see if you'll be allowed entry or not. It's more for the airline than for you. If you have an ESTA and get refused entry, the airline isn't fined for bringing someone unauthorized to the border.

> A visa allows you entry

That's incorrect, holding a B1/B2 US visa only allows you to arrive at the port of entry, the actual permission to enter the country is always left to the border officer interviewing you

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#43

Post by RandomLensman »

some_random wrote: post #40
RandomLensman wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the US gets the data anyway, why the need for access?

It's to validate that the fingerprints of the person arriving are the same as the fingerprints of the person who got the passport.

The fingerprints in the passport can't do that?

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#44

Post by phoronixrly »

RandomLensman wrote: post #34
tokai wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To reduce friction of traveling to the US obviously.

No more waiting in a long immigration queue?

I've always wanted to wait in an ICE concentration camp instead

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#45

Post by RandomLensman »

kalleboo wrote: post #32
RandomLensman wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the US gets the data anyway, why the need for access?

I would imagine it to match that the biometrics on file with the biometrics presented at the border to catch forgeries?

Is there a high incidence of forgeries?

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#46

Post by account42 »

Vinnl wrote: post #16
raxxorraxor wrote: post #2

As a European these texts are always a bit embarrassing. The evil USA that abuses our data... No, European countries suck completely on their own. There are people in jail without due process, we have histories full of systematic abuse of children/people with disabilities in care units, blatant disregard for constitutional rights by executive forces and you have these cases like this surfacing every other week. You d…

> There is no leverage so I fail to see how this could succeed. Isn't there upside to the US too if more Europeans visit the US?

Exactly, and of course the EU can (and should) also reciprocate and apply the same restrictions to US travellers. There kind of visa-free agreements existed in the first place because they interest both countries involved.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#47

Post by christoph »

kalleboo wrote: post #32
RandomLensman wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the US gets the data anyway, why the need for access?

I would imagine it to match that the biometrics on file with the biometrics presented at the border to catch forgeries?

Also think espionage/intelligence - those passports won't be forgeries (as they will gov issued), but there will be people travelling around the world with multiple "identities" shall we say, and this is going to make all that much harder.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#48

Post by rafram »

RandomLensman wrote: post #43
some_random wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's to validate that the fingerprints of the person arriving are the same as the fingerprints of the person who got the passport.

The fingerprints in the passport can't do that?

Most countries' passports don't include fingerprint data. The US passport application process is entirely digital/by mail, for example, with no fingerprinting at all.

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#49

Post by rocqua »

inigyou wrote: post #30
cm2187 wrote: post #18

I fail to understand the distinction between an ESTA and a visa to be honest. You need to do the paperwork in advance, pay, provide all sort of personal information, and it can be denied, and if approved only for a limited amount of time. Given that both the EU and the UK have reciprocated, it is a fiction that there exists some visa free travel between these 3 zones. And the more hassle you create, the less tourism…

A visa allows you entry, an ESTA doesn't allow you entry but just says you're allowed to travel to the border to see if you'll be allowed entry or not. It's more for the airline than for you. If you have an ESTA and get refused entry, the airline isn't fined for bringing someone unauthorized to the border.

https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/tourism-...

It states regarding a visa: "A visa allows a foreign citizen to travel to a U.S. port-of-entry (generally an airport) and request permission to enter the United States. A visa does not guarantee entry into the United States.

The Department of Homeland Security (DHS), U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officials at the port-of-entry have authority to permit or deny admission to the United States. "

Re: The EU is about to sell our most sensitive data to the US for visa-free travel

#50

Post by maratc »

RandomLensman wrote: post #34
tokai wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To reduce friction of traveling to the US obviously.

No more waiting in a long immigration queue?

I assume you would have to wait anyway but the processing of your person would be faster.

With that, I much prefer US immigration queues than EU immigration queues — as of 2026, my US times are much faster than my EU times.

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