Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
chinese-ai-report.com
Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
1–9 of 9 posts
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#2[deleted]
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#3Interesting. There is state-linked capital, big tech, VC, and foreign/sovereign money.
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#4Interesting. There is state-linked capital, big tech, VC, and foreign/sovereign money.
In other words, it is fairly typical of many Chinese "companies".
What many in the West seem to have trouble grasping is the fact that a "company" in China is not an autonomous economic construct but is instead more deeply intertwined with the state.
A Chinese "company" is a hybrid entity that only exists with the approval of and in cooperation with and in service to the state. Just ask Jack Ma.
Complaining that this doesn't match the way the game is played in the West does nothing to deflect the competition it presents. It is specifically designed to break Western style free market capitalism and AI is a prominent test case.
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#5Interesting. There is state-linked capital, big tech, VC, and foreign/sovereign money.
In other words, it is fairly typical of many Chinese "companies". What many in the West seem to have trouble grasping is the fact that a "company" in China is not an autonomous economic construct but is instead more deeply intertwined with the state. A Chinese "company" is a hybrid entity that only exists with the approval of and in cooperation with and in service to the state. Just ask Jack Ma. Complaining that this…
Well, everything in non-democratic countries, except (part of) organised crime, exist with the approval and in service of the state. So formal ownership doesn't matter there (this is why Chinese stock market is a joke).
I don't think anyone assumed it to be any different. This is the case in every non-democratic country and this is exactly why capitalism is inseparable with democracy (because there won't be capital when there is no system that ensures that it won't be arbitrarily taken from you, with you thrown into "re-education" camp). Similarly, socialism is inseparable with authoritarianism because give people real voting rights and they will vote socialism out. Hybrid regimes that have been attempted, quickly flipped onto one or the other side - democratic capitalism, or authoritarian socialism - because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management.
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#6Earlier quoted context omitted.
In other words, it is fairly typical of many Chinese "companies". What many in the West seem to have trouble grasping is the fact that a "company" in China is not an autonomous economic construct but is instead more deeply intertwined with the state. A Chinese "company" is a hybrid entity that only exists with the approval of and in cooperation with and in service to the state. Just ask Jack Ma. Complaining that this…
Well, everything in non-democratic countries, except (part of) organised crime, exist with the approval and in service of the state. So formal ownership doesn't matter there (this is why Chinese stock market is a joke). I don't think anyone assumed it to be any different. This is the case in every non-democratic country and this is exactly why capitalism is inseparable with democracy (because there won't be capital w…
because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management.
Is this a fact --- or a hope?
China is a different culture and is carving it's own path --- one that doesn't exactly match any that came before.
The West expected that it would change China. What is actually happening is China is changing the West.
For example, trade with the USA is now controlled by one person. It's hard to get much more authoritarian and anti-capitalistic than this.
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#7Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, everything in non-democratic countries, except (part of) organised crime, exist with the approval and in service of the state. So formal ownership doesn't matter there (this is why Chinese stock market is a joke). I don't think anyone assumed it to be any different. This is the case in every non-democratic country and this is exactly why capitalism is inseparable with democracy (because there won't be capital w…
because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management. Is this a fact --- or a hope? China is a different culture and is carving it's own path --- one that doesn't exactly match any that came before. The West expected that it would change China. What is actually happening is China is changing the West. For example, trade with the USA is now controlled by one person. It's hard…
I only meant to say that China will simply revert to government ownership of virtually everything, eventually, when they will no longer need to maintain the mask of capitalism. Government already owns 60% of productive capital there.
I didn't mean to say that China is set for failure as a nation. Merely that it will eventually become again fully "socialist"/"communist" rather than remain a hybrid system it currently is.
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#8Earlier quoted context omitted.
because they are unsustainable and can only be maintained for some time with careful management. Is this a fact --- or a hope? China is a different culture and is carving it's own path --- one that doesn't exactly match any that came before. The West expected that it would change China. What is actually happening is China is changing the West. For example, trade with the USA is now controlled by one person. It's hard…
I only meant to say that China will simply revert to government ownership of virtually everything, eventually, when they will no longer need to maintain the mask of capitalism. Government already owns 60% of productive capital there. I didn't mean to say that China is set for failure as a nation. Merely that it will eventually become again fully "socialist"/"communist" rather than remain a hybrid system it currently…
But will the USA eventually become again fully "democratic"/"capitalist" rather than remain a hybrid (aka fascist) system it currently is?
I think judgments and predictions are far from certain in both cases and are mainly rooted in bias and wishful thinking.
Re: Who's Subsidizing Chinese AI
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
I only meant to say that China will simply revert to government ownership of virtually everything, eventually, when they will no longer need to maintain the mask of capitalism. Government already owns 60% of productive capital there. I didn't mean to say that China is set for failure as a nation. Merely that it will eventually become again fully "socialist"/"communist" rather than remain a hybrid system it currently…
But will the USA eventually become again fully "democratic"/"capitalist" rather than remain a hybrid (aka fascist) system it currently is? I think judgments and predictions are far from certain in both cases and are mainly rooted in bias and wishful thinking.
Either this, or will instead become a China-like full-on fascist. Because capitalism stops working if there are no guarantees of private property (no point to own stock if company can be nationalised, diluted, or simply gifted to a crony at whim), and every dictatorship eventually slides to that territory. US is no exception. It will not remain a hybrid for a long time - it will go either way.